https://bit.ly/34HgmWk
2020 is the year of the Latin breakthrough. Bad Bunny was Spotify's most streamed artist of the year. Latin represented 30% of the global YouTube chart. And Latin is growing faster than any other genre. Proving, once again, that technology, distribution, affects the music being heard.
Used to be records broke on radio. Now they break online. And as word spreads, people play them over and over again and we can see their popularity in raw numbers. Yes, the internet has finally eviscerated the music business's propensity for lying. Well, not completely, there's still subterfuge, but even Justin Bieber couldn't buy a hit, couldn't run the numbers up. You might be able to make a dent by gaming the system, buying streams, but the top of the chart is all genuine. What is happening?
We no longer have a cohesive Top Ten. Ten tracks that everybody listens to. The business is doing its best to anoint said ten, newspapers print the manipulated numbers, but one check online shows them to be phony.
According to the disinformation society made up of the industry and the media, Taylor Swift was the artist of the year, with two breakthrough albums, that topped the chart consistently. Only in the real world, this is completely untrue. Check it out for yourself. She's got not one single track in the U.S. Top Tracks of 2020 nor the global edition.
"Top Tracks of 2020 USA": https://spoti.fi/2WIorFR
"Top Tracks of 2020": https://spoti.fi/38xYheF
I won't bother commenting on the quality of Taylor Swift's two lps, but I will say turnabout is fair play and leave it at that.
Once again, the media is out of touch with what is really going on. Hell, on a more important level it had no idea what was going on in the 2020 Presidential race, had no idea so many people would support Trump, and that the issue of packing the court was a nonstarter, although there's a chance the Democrats will eke out two victories in Georgia, but odds are not in their favor. But what do odds even mean these days?
TV might be a walled garden, Fox News might have undue influence, but that's not the case online, where there are no boundaries, and everybody can get a track on Spotify.
Then again, if we go to pure streaming numbers, the majors will lose control of the chart, and that just can't happen!
In other words, what is perceived to be big is just not so. Rock rules on the road, the Spotify Top 50 doesn't correspond. But forever, touring gets no respect, it's all about record sales/streams. But don't ticket sales represent true demand, when people put their dollars down for ducats?
What we've got here is a multifarious music business. The usual suspect powers have lost control. As for their supposed market share, how much of that is made up of distributed indies?
As for genres... Turns out people have a desire for much more than hip-hop and pop. Hip-hop did put a dent in rock, no doubt about it, not that rock did not shoot itself in the foot, not that rock is not moribund, but will Latin eclipse hip-hop as the next major genre?
I'm not holding my breath, but the history of the modern music business is just when something becomes gigantic, supposedly indomitable, it's replaced by something new, with energy, and the old falls by the wayside, can you say "hair bands," that were eclipsed by grunge?
Then again, rockers have been anti-streaming from day one. Meanwhile, hip-hop artists and fans embraced the new distribution format, as did Latin fans and even country fans. Want to win in today's world, don't criticize Spotify, EMBRACE IT! Check the numbers, if you're at the top of the chart you're making more money than ever before. And you're gonna get paid until the end of the track's copyright. As for the de minimis numbers of old acts that once had record deals...maybe people just don't want to listen to your music that much, or maybe you're really a live act. You cannot change the past.
And the past is filled with dirgey celebrity/charity records. Songs no one would put on an album under their own name. Meanwhile, this rendition of "Feliz Navidad" is upbeat, it swings! It's hard to stay motionless while you're listening to it. Especially today, if you want traction, publicity only goes so far, it's got to be in the grooves.
So, I dare you to watch this clip and know who everybody is. No way. Most of the acts are Latin, and those who know the Latin acts probably won't know Big & Rich, never mind Sam Moore and Tommy Shaw. And the youngsters probably won't know Moore or Shaw either. But Styx sells tickets every summer, and Sam, with his departed partner Dave, are the original soul men.
Hold on, they're coming. The Latinos. And we've seen the same thing with hip-hop. All the oldsters who are racist would be stunned to find out their kids love the "urban" sound. Ditto on the music of the minority group known as "Latinos." As for "Latinx"...if you've been following this story, most Latinos don't like it and don't use it, just like Black people may be against police brutality, but not policing in general.
Then again, now I've gotten your hackles up, by speaking truth. Ain't that America, where not only do people not utter the truth, but people can't HANDLE THE TRUTH! Especially on the left, with trigger warnings...IT'S A DAMN BOOK!
But today we embrace the holiday spirit, and nothing I've seen this year has done a better job of it than this clip. Watch it.
Oh yeah, before you do, click "SHOW MORE" under José's name, to see who's involved, you can't tell the players without a scorecard!
P.S. For more Latin info/statistics, I point you to this fact-filled "Billboard" article, "Inside Latin Music's Global Takeover": https://bit.ly/37QyYW9
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Friday 25 December 2020
Thursday 24 December 2020
Jacob Collier-This Week's Podcast
Jacob Collier's "Djesse Vol. 3" was the surprise of the Grammy nominations, landing a spot for Album of the Year. Jacob is fully aware that other artists were excluded, and he is a fan of both the Weeknd and Lady Gaga, but separate yourself from the blowback and Collier's story is both fascinating and inspirational. Only 26, Collier is a digital native who explored Logic and posted a video to YouTube and then all hell broke loose. Hang in there, it's a wild ride.
https://www.iheart.com/podcast/1119-the-bob-lefsetz-podcast-30806836/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/jacob-collier/id1316200737?i=1000503399066
https://www.stitcher.com/show/the-bob-lefsetz-podcast/episode/jacob-collier-80383543
https://open.spotify.com/episode/03Q4RcBret9JCfOmMcJad5?si=Ami0NoWBT5G68K-bGemZ2g
https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/9ff4fb19-54d4-41ae-ae7a-8a6f8d3dafa8/The-Bob-Lefsetz-Podcast
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https://www.iheart.com/podcast/1119-the-bob-lefsetz-podcast-30806836/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/jacob-collier/id1316200737?i=1000503399066
https://www.stitcher.com/show/the-bob-lefsetz-podcast/episode/jacob-collier-80383543
https://open.spotify.com/episode/03Q4RcBret9JCfOmMcJad5?si=Ami0NoWBT5G68K-bGemZ2g
https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/9ff4fb19-54d4-41ae-ae7a-8a6f8d3dafa8/The-Bob-Lefsetz-Podcast
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Wednesday 23 December 2020
More Disco Demolitiion Night
I was the format designer and consultant at THE LOOP back in the Disco Demolition era. Race or Homophobia was never even remotely discussed as a component of the promotion. It was all about the Midwest 16-34 Men that the station targeted and their disdain for the disco movement. The factors that DID play into it were the 180 degree opposites from the Loop's hard rock fueled audience perceptions, Including:
Rock was about power guitars and real drummers
Disco was about electronics
Rock was about sweaty live events
Disco was about slick clubs with a bouncer in case you didn't look hot enough
Rock was long hair
Disco wasn't
Rock was about smoking dope and groovin
Disco was about cocaine and champagne
Rock was about dressing down
Disco was about dressing up
...the list goes on, but the point was a rock statement not a racial one...
It's unfortunate that perceptions of it being a homophobic or racist promotion. I certainly, in hindsight, see that. But at the time those negative feelings were completely off our radar.
The station pioneered a lot of elements that re-enforced the ROCK movement. And I'm sure everyone involved is saddened that it became perceived by some as a culture killer.
Lee Abrams
____________________________________
I'm late to the party on this but since I was in the thick of it as a consultant, here's what happened.
First, history is a narrative laid upon carefully selected facts that tell different stories. With that as backdrop...
Steve Dahl was a brilliant promoter and disc jockey. He could think up stunts that electrified Chicago. Disco demolition was just one of them. It was more about the fact that disco was getting a lot more attention than rock at the time so the idea of blowing up disco records seems like a good idea. In all my time knowing Steve Dahl or any of the other people involved, there was never anything racist about it. After all, the biggest disco band in the world was the Bee Gees and they were white.
That's another part of the problem. The Bee Gees documentary.
In a carefully selected clip, it showed black records being thrown into a bin to be blown up. However it didn't show that the majority of the records were white. One of the radio guys I worked with for years was standing beside the bin when the records were thrown in and said there were far more by bands like Loverboy and other white rock acts than there were black. His comment was that people simply grabbed any record to throw it in the bin just to see it blowing up. Once again, history is written by the exclusion of facts rather than the inclusion of facts.
Now, let's turn to the question of disco demolition being anti-gay. I was interviewed some years ago by a guy writing a thesis on disco demolition being an anti-gay phenomenon and suggesting that disco backlash was against gays.
We discussed it at length and I was clear that I never saw any evidence of it in the research I was doing at the time. Rather people were reacting against the whole glam and glitz of the scene.
Studio 54 was an exclusionary club that left people out and it was highly connected to disco. It was in the news all the time with people being left on the street because they weren't cool enough or glam enough. People don't like to be left out.
So part of the backlash was against a club scene that made "ordinary" people feel like they could never be part of it - rather than anything to do with gays.
In spite of my observations and strong research to back it up, the writer went on to publish a thesis that distorted what I said, claiming that the anti-disco movement was anti-gay. An example of academic destruction. You can Google it.
Also, during this time a lot of disco radio stations were popping up all over the country. I could see the backlash coming against disco music in all the research I was doing and I spoke in front of the largest conference of disco radio owners in the country, warning them that they may end up with problems. This was within weeks of Steve Dahl's disco demolition. I remember how they laughed out loud. Within a year none of them were on the air.
So, in the interest of setting the record straight, musical trends come and go. If I wanted to push the case, I would say that there is a bias against white males in commercial radio because most of them are pop stations that don't play any rock. Of course, that would be ridiculous. Yet I'm sure someone will figure out a way to claim that it's true.
By the way, I think that the Bee Gees documentary on HBO has restirred the pot. Which is too bad because it's a fabulous piece of entertainment devoid of real politics.
John Parikhal
____________________________________
Thanks for posting both of these. Amazing how people can twist something to fit their narrative.
I know–with 100% certainty–that Dave Logan and Lee Abrams would have had NOTTTTHHHHHING to do with some sort of racist or homophobic plot. Lee, like me, is just a nice, Jewish kid from Flossmoor, Illinois. And Dave is as count-on-able as they come. They, along with Dahl, were just some young, irreverent rock guys looking to have some fun.
Ultimately, it helped Logan fulfill a lifelong dream, to win one for the Tigers. LOL.
Best regards,
Scott Struber
____________________________________
Those two contrasting letters regarding Disco Demolition Night are very instructive, and I didn't want to let the moment pass without commentary. I like to say that the difference between conservatives and liberals is that conservatives often don't believe white supremacy is even real, while liberals know full well it is but are in denial about their own role within it.
I have no doubt Steve Dahl was completely blind to the racial and heteronormative undercurrents of the anti-disco movement. Part of what makes whiteness and hetero maleness a form of privilege is that you don't ever have to examine your own motivations and biases. They're just the default of the culture.
But when black people tell you they feel the undercurrent of racism, when gay people tell you they feel the undercurrent of homophobia, it doesn't do to dismiss them as oversensitive. To be a marginalized minority is to be ever-aware of the way the dominant culture suppresses your voice and marginalizes your views and opinions. The fact that suppression is often unconscious doesn't mean it's not there. That the person doing the suppressing is a liberal with a self-image as a non-racist, non-homophobe does not mean their actions can't be racist or homophobic.
It's not an accident the target of the ire was disco, an extremely pluralistic genre that openly celebrated blackness and gayness in an era when both were conspicuously absent from most of the mainstream media.
This is not to condemn Dahl or the other anti-disco showmen of the era. The culture has moved on a lot since 1978 and more and more of us have begun to confront our own unconscious biases and the way we privilege our own viewpoint to the exclusion of others. But never mistake the white cis-het viewpoint for some kind of absolute truth. It's just one version of the truth, albeit the one with the biggest army and the deepest pockets.
Jonathan Steigman
____________________________________
Whether Steve Dahl intended for Disco Demolition to be racist & homophobic is completely missing the point:
Dahl provided a venue for racists and homophobes to rally. It was a huge mistake.
Do racists know they're racist? Hardly. The culture of the past 100 years has produced racists & homophobes on both sides of the aisle.
Is Steve Dahl a racist/homophobe? Who cares?
Bill Seipel
____________________________________
Sign me up for #teamVince. I'm relieved to see you would print a letter from someone who points out your dog whistle to your primarily white fan base. As a 13 year old in 1978, I thought disco demolition night was a last gasp from the ancestors of Confederates, before the country moved to the path Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. paved 10 years earlier.
White guys only appreciate black people making music at their nieces and daughters weddings.
Black people who read you know that if Darius Rucker fronted the Red Hot Chili Peppers, they would be called a hip hop group. RHCP can break through with a Stevie Wonder song, while Living Coulour, King's X and Fishbone never got the promotional support they deserved.
Please bring that podcast to fruition.
I will always tell smart people to read you,
Steve Smith
____________________________________
Revisionist history? I'm sorry, Paul "friend of Steve Dahl's" Natkin, but one of America's biggest actors, Bob Odenkirk, did an episode of Drunk HIstory about this, and took the standard "Disco sucks" perspective. There's many videos of Dahl dogwhistling in interviews about how he shouldn't have to wear glitter to leave the house. Dahl has been pleading and bleating his case that he was just earnestly not into disco for so long, he's the epitome of the "empty vessels make the most noise" idiom. The only revisionist history that happens about the disco demolition is from Dahl and his defenders. Oh, and "He found himself unemployed because of progress so he took up a mantle against something inanimate and abstract instead of adapting" is the origin story for like half of all villains.
Trevor Risk
____________________________________
Bob, a big segment of music fans dug the dance music trends in the 70s and 80s. The labels, operating true to form, milked the disco style dry, running it-and themselves-into the ground. But throughout the era, there were plenty of alternate listening options for those whose music discovery ability went beyond tuning in the local top-40 station.
To deem someone's creative output unworthy is ignorant. To stage a massive public event encouraging such ignorance is wrongful conduct.
It was a hateful, stupid, racist, homophobic, anti-music, anti-common sense reflection of America's worst. Pigs.
Yesteryear's "Disco Sucks" acolytes are today's Trump voters. Paul Lanning
____________________________________
When disco happened, my contemporaries and I hated it for a number of reasons, including the dumbing down of the drum parts (I'm a drummer), the lack of guts or soul in the music itself, and disco's extolling the dancing/dancers to the exclusion of the musicians. I remember an article in People Magazine around 1979 that made that very point, i.e., that the dancers were the stars, and not the musicians, to the point where the live concert business was suffering.
Never once did my friends and I even consider a racist or homophobic reason for hating the disco genre. After all, blues, R&B and rock owe their existence directly to the Black community that essentially created it. Also, it might be noted that the Bee Gees, undeniably -- however reluctantly -- the poster child group of Disco, were White and straight.
Now, I cannot attest to what my African-American friends and associates thought of Disco Demolition or anti-disco sentiments at the time, but I never heard or saw any hint of this -- or a homophobic -- viewpoint at the time. In fact, the first time such a notion has been asserted, to my knowledge, was in the Bee Gees documentary.
As a historian by education, I have always been wary of revisionism, i.e., altering historical analysis or conclusions to fit a current trend or fad. Without disrespecting Vince Lawrence, it seems to me as if his recollection of that period is revisionism, pure and simple.
Douglas Weinstein
____________________________________
Woah man did that dude piss me off.
The first disco record I heard was coming out of a stereo in my house. I had no idea who the artist was. If they were black, gay or from New Zealand. It was Fly Robin Fly and the sound of that record turned my stomach.
I worked retail in Bklyn, on Kings Highway, the disco capital of the US back then, during that era and found records like Push Push In The Bush, YMCA, Take The Time etc to be vapid, sometimes sexist and unlistenable.
You'll find at least a half a dozen Donna Summer tracks in my phone.
Larry Tepper
____________________________________
Here's how history works. It doesn't matter how straight white guys saw it. It matters how Black and Gay people saw it.
Seek to understand.
Bryson Jones
____________________________________
I'm with Vince. I also saw it as racist and homophobic and I happen to be white and straight.
Frank Malfitano
____________________________________
I am born, raised and living in Puerto Rico.
Back in the 70's I was into Salsa, Rock and Jazz.
Could not stand Disco. Disco Demolition was not "racist" to me.
I would much rather listen to Freddie Hubbard or George Benson, both black.
Not to mention all the Salsa guys…or the Blues guys behind Rock.
Joey Sala
San Juan, PR
____________________________________
Good Day Bob,
I really don't know how society moves forward
as one. We can't agree on facts, we can't agree on the past, and we definitely can't agree on how to proceed in the future.
I wasn't at disco demolition night as I was only 3 at the time, and have never lived in Chicago either. Amazing that the organizers of the event see it one way and some other guy who claims to have been there that night sees it completely differently. I don't make a habit of calling people liars without evidence so I tend to believe Paul Natkin's account. I feel Mr. Lawrence lost a great deal of credibility as soon as he made a not so subtle plea for public exposure at your expense.
At the end of the day I suppose my opinion isn't all that relevant on this matter, but what a depressing reality that one man's reaction to having lost his job because of a segment of his industry that he strongly disliked for musical taste reasons has been twisted into him being a racist and homophobe. I never knew the guy so I can't comment on his personal views, but isn't it possible that he just hated disco music? I hate rap music - no matter what color the rapper. My ears just hate the sound - nothing more, nothing less. I prefer guitars, real drums played by a drummer, melody sung by someone who can sing, and bass mixed in at the appropriate level. Doesn't make me a racist.
Merry Christmas and Happy Hanukkah, bro.
Tim W
in Calgary
____________________________________
Bob, Paul Natkin is one of the great rock photographers, based in Chicago. I'd love for you to do a post about rock photographers and seek out their perspectives on the music of the 60s, 70s and the 80s.
I would agree that Dahl did not promote the night at Comiskey as anything but a night to celebrate rock and roll by destroying disco records. However, there were many in the audience and in general who hated disco because of the audience it attracted: people of color and non-heterosexual.
Mark Guncheon
____________________________________
Excellent note from Chicago's great photographer Paul Natkin.
He's absolutely right on every point. I was one of the crazed teenagers on the field, rock and roll Kid listening to The Loop FM 98.
We spent most of the time before the game getting lubricated and getting our smoke on for the night. I think we just enjoyed running around the field for kicks, but when a 12-inch record started flying past my head by inches, I scurried back to the lower-level stands to watch the rest. Plenty of footage on YouTube will show you what that action was like that night!
Dfactor Dave
____________________________________
I remember when I first heard the 12" disco remix of Blondie's "Heart of Glass" and thinking, "uh-oh, we're fucked."
And lo and behold "Da Ya Think I'm Sexy" came along.
Dave Curtis
____________________________________
I was a 13 year old Cubs fan at the time and from my suburban Chicago seat, I was mostly glad to see Comiskey Park get trashed. I was definitely a Loop listener and Steve Dahl fan and had no racial animosity. Probably naive at the time.
Take care!
Sam Schauer
____________________________________
Some of us hated disco because we thought that compared to funk, soul and jazz it sounded like insipid crap played by machines, and we were too insecure and self-conscious to let loose & party down with the folks who got off on it - regardless of their skin color or sexual orientation. But hey, I'm glad that many people found joy and comfort in Gloria Gaynor's "I Will Survive".
For me, it was never about the people. The music just left me cold.
Joe Paulino
____________________________________
This is a great conversation. Until today I never considered the possibility that the disco demolition stunt was racist, but that may be my own ignorance. I guess I never considered disco to be race-specific.
Bird
____________________________________
Agree with you and Paul. Nice to share the two perspectives.
Kyle J. Ferraro
____________________________________
Far too often white people don't "see" things as racist. It's how we got to this moment.
Peter Buffett
____________________________________
Once again, a clear picture of America today. Two diametrically opposed takes on the same event.
David Rubin
____________________________________
As someone your age, I remember being disappointed that disco was becoming so popular at the expense of rock. I vaguely remember something about disco demolition. I never heard of Steve Dahl before but I understand his thinking. And DJs are always out there and promoting stuff. so if you have a gimmick like blowing up a record to get people's attention and it works, you keep doing it.
I was saddened that rock was being replaced. Why are all these people liking this music? Didn't matter if it was good, bad, whatever. It was taking over from the rock music that I loved.
And as a cover band musician, we sure as hell learned disco songs. ( I did like Richard Finch's bass lines on KC songs).
Same thing with Hip Hop today, replacing what came before it. And something new will replace hip hop some day.
Dale Janus
____________________________________
merry hanukkah, xmas, and happy safe new year..
wow, u got thrown right in the eye of the hurricane.
no matter what you say, peoples perception of events,
thru the lens of years, will never line up.
our reality vs.vince's realty will never line up.
nothing you can say about innocence etc
will ever be acknowledged.
\the cancel button is in front of U.
i feel for you, and hope you stay BOB.
you r a solid caring human. thats all that matters.
stay safe, and warm..
with all my respect,
marc brickman
____________________________________
Very interesting, contrasting views.
It may not have been a racist homophobic thing, but I liked Disco in the late 1970s, Donna Summer, and some others, and thought the whining of the rock people was annoying. Yes, Disco is very seasy to do badly, and that is partly why some disliked it, and its minimal lyrics, something I never liked about it, made it sound plastic at times, but rock is not much better. There is the term three-chord rock and all that screaming. It's sad you can't like both genres for the unique contributions to American culture that they are.
Best
David
____________________________________
Hello, my name is Jim Marcus. As a member of the Box Boys and Die Warzau, I was part of the dance music scene here in Chicago, both house and industrial. I've continuously worked here as a remixer, engineer, producer, artist, etc. since the early 80's and when Disco Demolition happened I was a young session musician. As an LGBTQ person myself, it was clear exactly from what perspective this event happened and I very much saw the same thing Vince Lawrence did.
I remember sitting with friends that night in the studio and feeling unsafe in my own city. It seemed like the entire city had decided what it thought about the black and gay musicians that had just begun to gain acceptance on the air. Steve Dahl himself talked about how uncomfortable he was in clubs, as a heterosexual male, how he felt out of his element. His obvious discomfort at being around gay people was amplified in his followers, and that kind of othering of LGBTQ people was pervasive at the event.
It seems easy to us now to look back and call out what is Disco and what wasn't, the truth is that many of the records that were burned that night were just records from black artists. And much of the vitriol was aimed squarely at the fluid, gender playful, disco fans and artists who were finally finding a way to be themselves ion public.
If you are not gay, trans, bisexual, etc. you may have no idea what freedoms Disco offered people. Steve Dahl wrote about intimidation and disenfranchisement when walking into a dance club, but never considered for a moment that the people at home in that club were HONESTLY intimidated and disenfranchised by a community that saw policemen sit in their cars while gay and trans people were beaten in the streets.
If Dahl himself wants to deny that he was racist or homophobic, I would love to see him come to it honestly, by asking himself why he stood there in front of thousands of, nearly to the person, white straight males, screaming and circulating the message. He can maybe explain why he didn't hear what they screamed back. Because I guarantee you that those of us in the city who were different, gay, trans, black, latino, we got the message loud and clear.
Regards,
Jim Marcus
____________________________________
I commend you for posting these two opposing views, but I believe anyone of good faith and any conscience whatsoever must admit that it's Vince Lawrence's perspective that is the correct one.
Racism and xenophobia is so intrinsic to the very genesis and fabric of this country that all of us white men, in particular, even those among us who try and wish to be allies can't help but suffer from living within the limited perspective of simply being white men.
Any white person who denies that simple and obvious phenomenon or that disco hatred was clearly just thinly veiled hatred for the "other", black and gay people is utterly deluding themselves, which is itself racist and xenophobic as hell! It's akin to Trump voters denying their obvious racism and screaming about economic anxiety as they adorn their $80k pickup trucks with a million MAGA flags and brandish their $2k AR-15s demanding haircuts. They're only fooling fools.
I enjoyed the Bee Gees documentary immensely and was actually tempted to respond vociferously about how wrong and obviously biased your recollection of the disco demolition was, but Vincent's response was so much more powerful, not just because he was there and in the film, but because he has the lifetime experience of systemic racism that us white guys NEVER will.
Thank you Vince for setting the record straight! Anyone who disagrees is telling on themselves.
I'd love to hear Vincent absolutely demolish Steve Dahl's dim white guy perspective, again, so I'm hoping Vincent's suggestion of a podcast can happen. More people need to be taught how deep is their hate before they can understand how deep their love could and should be.
And I think the Bee Gees would agree.
Martin Ferrini
____________________________________
Steve Dahl was a fat bastard socially inept and couldn't get laid even if he had speed boat on Gilligan's Island.
I am not going to get into the "hemming and hawing" ...heres the bottom.line ...
The major label promotion people hated and I do mean hated disco ( the lifestyle and the music ) . They especially hated that all the hot chicks and the best drugs were ready available in a club where they just did not fit in . They hated that the PDs in their respective markets ( many of which were closet gay ) were finding songs on their respective labels that weren't "priorities " and adding them with nothing more than a " by the way we are adding song x I heard it at a disco over the weekend ". The label reps thought disco was a gay thing and anybody whom liked it was gay as well . I know this to be 100% true because I went thru it whn I moved from being the RFC / WB East Coast Dance Music Rep to joining Atlantic as the Boston Rep. . Shit ..I got fired for getting a song I liked added at 4 Boston stations. Stacy Lattisaw " Let Me Be Your Angle " ...was not a priority and was not on Atlantic radar. Vince Feracci called me that Tuesday afternoon " If you want to get records played at radio that you like you should get a job at radio .. YOURE FIRED !!" I took Vince advise ....
I became Sunny Joe Whites Asst MD then MD at Kiss 108 .
Back to Dahl . This too I know to be a fact ..... the record companies drop shipped 1000s of records ( cutouts ) to Chicago because 90% of the morons he reached didnt hve disco records in their collection to blow up.
Bottom Line : before disco clubs were 100% segregated ....white , black,gay ,straight ' hispanic .... the Disco brought us all together under one roof... I saw the desegregation happen..I was part of it ...
It was wonderful !!!
Joey Carvello
Billboard Disco Deejay Of The Year 1978 /Boston
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I was at the ballgame. at the time i was a 21 white kid from the suburbs of NYC, I was not really a fan of disco, but i did not go to protest music, hell I had been to disco's to meet girls, it was a right of passage in the late 70's.
I was visiting my sister in Chicago and was told about the event at a local bar. I attended because I am a huge baseball fan and a double header made sense. I paid full price for good box seats. Most of the people that stormed the field had general admission as the promotion was bring a disco record to plow up between games and you get in with GA seats for 98 cents ( station # was 98 point something FM )
The demonstration was a dud, The records were put into a large contained box in center field, the all you saw was smoke. Steve Dahl was kind of funny until the crowd started to boo. He was dressed up in a old army jacket and helmet, like he was protesting Viet Nam or something.
The crowd was acting up during the first game, those that could not get the GA tickets and still had their records were using them as frisbee's. I know the Detroit third baseman was wearing a batting helmet while fielding, he was quoted in the news defending disco music before the game.
I for one was not happy when the crowd ran ointo the field, tore up the infield, ripped the bases out and would not leave. I was really not happy when the second game was forfeited. The White Sox owner announced any valid ticket could be used for another game, like a rainout. I was leaving Chicago before the next home game, so i gave my ticket to my sister to give out.
In retrospect I was witness to history first hand, had a story to tell. At the time i thought it was a dumb idea that went wrong.
Tom Melle
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Two great letters providing a very different perspective on this unique event in my home town.
I did not attend the game. I was a Cubs fan living on the southside (Sox Country). I was 19 in 1978, a white kid from an immigrant family, first year dating my wife of 34 years, the most beautiful woman and only Cuban I had ever met. Chicago was and still is a highly segregated city, and as in 1978 remains racist. However, for some reason it never occured to me that others would have an issue with my choice of spouse. My wife was also an immigrant, and despite growing up much of her childhood and young adult life in Chicago she swears she never experienced racism. Hard to believe given the tough neighborhoods we lived in, schools we attended, but that is her perspective and I know she believes it.
I didn't march with Dr. King, I was only a child when he and 20,000 (whites, blacks, browns, nuns, priests, rabbis, business leaders, politicians, etc.) locked arm-in-arm proudly marched down California Ave to Marquette Park on the southside of Chicago. However, I did view the event from the safety of my best friend's front porch (later County District Attorney) and it was not a pretty sight. I haven't lived in Chicago for some 35 years, but spent half my time working there during the last 9 years. It certainly has improved over the years, but there's much more work to do.
I listened to Steve because I was into Classic Rock and he had a good shtick with his side-kick Gary...of course at the time it was just Rock, not yet Classic...but it never occured to me then or until you brought it up that it was some kind of racist or homophobic event. Couldn't walk a block in Chicago without running into a racist or homophobic, but I knew plenty of folks that went to the event and talked about it for years afterwards and none of us had that angle. The big news then and still now is that the Sox forfeited a game. And if I recall it was the effective end of Steve's career, such as it was.
Bill Veeck, Sox owner, was the master of promotion and he was the furthest thing from a racist...he was an upstanding guy...so I understand why no one would have associated Bill with promoting such an event.
Had I walked in different shoes back then, black or gay, I suspect I too would've had an entire different view and I appreciate the comments from Mr. Lawrence. Different people experiencing the same event, living at the same time, in the same place, and with different recollections. And all very real, no doubt.
Thanks for sharing their letters.
E Kelly
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Thank you for presenting e-mails of both perspectives (Vince Lawrence and Paul Natkin). My heart still races from the thought of the Disco Demolition. I was 10 years old and I remember the spray painted buildings with Disco Sucks and the light posts carved with WBLS - We Black Love Sh*t . WBLS was top R&B Station. Mr. Natkin may have not realized that the actions were racist or homophobic but it was. The ramifications of those actions were felt throughout black neighborhoods. It was a direct attack on the music we loved and it caused a divide.
Thanks for reading.
Jeff James
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it's likely bordering on the absurd levels of obvious to say no one care what I think about race. Certainly, as a middle-aged white dude, I have very little to offer except my own experience. It may be useful.
I was anti-disco. I had no idea at the time this position was infused with race. I never thought Stevie Wonder, Earth Wind and Fire, or Al Green were disco. I loved those artists then as I do now. We can debate the Bee Gees, but history has changed my thinking about the demolition.
I live in the south and lack a lot of the self-loathing white guilt that I probably should feel. At the same time, I'm all about tearing down the statues of the traders of the confederacy and I don't care about the rebel flag one way or the other. Burn it. I'll hand you a match. Fly it behind your truck. I'll thank you silently for outing yourself as an asshole.
What I do care about is music. I saw this interview https://youtu.be/dTvNjPFjlNE?t=3301 with Roger Joseph Manning Jr. and it literally turned me 180 degrees on Saturday Night Fever and disco in general. The Bee Gees doc did a lot to affirm my newfound appreciation for what they accomplished in the mid 70's in Miami.
In the clear light of history and hindsight, yea, the Disco demolition was a racist act. I'm pretty sure the people that came up with the idea weren't racist. What all this has taught me in retrospect is that when it comes to prejudice, intent is irrelevant. Very few people mean to be racist or prejudice. We just are, unless we consciously review our thoughts and actions and screen for it. Even then, we often miss. We're human.
In July 1979, I wouldn't have thought twice about blowing up bad dance records (or bad rock records for that matter) and never considered race. Blowing shit up is awesome. Why I never thought in the '90s to suggest that a station blow up hair metal bands is beyond me. The argument that "it's been done" would have been preposterous on its face. We re-did every successful promotion over and over. Hair metal, as a genre, deserved every gram of explosive disco ever got. So there you have it. Guilty.
Manning of course is correct. Albhy Galuten is an undeniable genius. The Cocteau Twins, Blue Nile, and the Beastie Boys all have proven me wrong about the legitimacy of loops and drum machines.
Sure, I still hate Roland 808 high-hats, but I get Migos. Are Roland 808's cultural signaling? Hell if I know. Probably. So what? Yes, I realize now I was racist and homophobic about Disco. There is no one to forgive me but myself and there is no one to apologize to for my ignorance. This is the problem of race in our time. We can be nice. We can ally. We can protest, but we cannot fix what was done. All we can do face our miserable failings and work for better tomorrow.
Perhaps we can reconsider the music we missed, too. There's always that.
Tom Barnes
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I'm waiting for what, I'm sure, will be an interesting and polarized reaction to Disco Demolition and figured I'd add my account of that night to the forthcoming scrum.
Full disclosure: I've known Steve Dahl for almost 45 years and in fact, was his roommate in Detroit when we first met. So, yep, we've been friends for a long, long time.
Back in July 1979, I was scheduled to fly to Chicago to do a presentation at the MCA Records Distribution offices for one of the bands I was managing. I lived in LA at the time. So Steve offered to let me stay with him and Janet (Steve's wife) while I was in town. "But," Steve told me, "you may wanna come in a couple of days earlier, because we're doing this promotion that might be interesting." He laid out the plans, but really had no idea how it would go. The way he convinced me to come was the game(s): A doubleheader between the ChiSox and Tigers. I'm a dyed in the wool Tigers fan.
Now, it might be helpful to elaborate here about something that Paul Natkin referenced in an earlier email to you. That is, what was the partial genesis for Steve's "anti-disco" attitude. During his years in Detroit, Steve's popularity skyrocketed as the morning air personality at Rock Radio AORs WABX and subsequently WWWW (W4). At the time there was even a third AOR station in the market—WRIF. WRIF was a part of the ABC Radio Network's chain of Album Rock stations, which included several others like KLOS (LA). Steve was becoming quite a star in Detroit, so ABC decided to back the truck up to Steve's door, dump a bunch of money, and hire him. But to go to their Chicago AOR station, WDAI. Their strategy was twofold: (1) Bring Steve to Chicago to bolster their struggling station, WDAI, and (2) get him the hell outta Detroit where he was kicking WRIF's ass.
Shortly after arriving in Chicago (within months), WDAI flipped formats from Rock to DISCO and canned Dahl. For Steve, shock and anger ensued. And that's when WLUP (The Loop) swooped in and hired him.
As for that night at Comiskey Park, it was one of the most insane events I've ever experienced. When we pulled into Comiskey's parking lot, there were literally thousands of people milling around. The game was sold out (50,000) and they couldn't get in. Steve looked at me and said, "I think this thing is gonna be bigger than we thought." No kidding. WLUP had a private press box right next to both the White Sox and Tigers broadcast booths, so we all had a really good view of the insanity. After the first game, a huge pile of records were set up and Steve came out. The crowd went bananas—many having kept their 12" vinyl and throwing them around like frisbees. When the explosion blew up, the crowd erupted and flooded the ball field. Absolutely burying Steve. We honestly feared for the guy's life. Scary.
Of course, the doubleheader's second game was canceled. And for what it's worth, after that night Steve Dahl became a huge, iconic and enduring celebrity in Chicago.
I expect most of your readers will be addressing the question of racism and homophobia, and rightfully so. Was that the intent of WLUP, the Chicago White Sox or Steve Dahl? I honestly do not think so. However, it's obvious that the event has had ramifications over the years that have proven unsettling, upsetting and even emblematic of some of the deepest problems that our nation confronts. Lord knows the last four years' Administration here in the US have shown us that we have a very long ways to go.
PS. One anecdote (out of so many). Being a huge baseball fan, I poked my head into the teams' broadcast booths where there were guys like Al Kaline doing the game. The White Sox analyst at the time was Jimmy Piersall, a former outfielder who was infamous for his genuinely bizarre antics on the playing field, as well as the movie based on his life, "Fear Strikes Out." Well, after the explosion, he stormed into The Loop's press box and grabbed me (of all people) by the collar, screaming at me as he reared back to punch me in the face! Fortunately Comiskey Park Security quietly intervened.
Anyway, that's some of my Disco Demolition experience, Bob.
There's so much more, but I'm tired of typing!
Play ball!
And Happy Holidays.
Hugh Surratt
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Boy- this one is out of control! I have known Steve Dahl
for +/- 40 years. Disco Demolition was never intended to
be political, racial, or for that matter- even serious.
It was for people who suddenly were forced to listen to nothing but Disco on the radio- whether they liked it or not.
Steve Dahl still lives in Chicago.
He has been on the radio his whole life.
He talks about what ever is going on- with no judgement.
I have never heard him radicalize about anything.
The only agenda I have ever heard from him on the air
is common sense.
Honest!
Joe Walsh
Rock was about power guitars and real drummers
Disco was about electronics
Rock was about sweaty live events
Disco was about slick clubs with a bouncer in case you didn't look hot enough
Rock was long hair
Disco wasn't
Rock was about smoking dope and groovin
Disco was about cocaine and champagne
Rock was about dressing down
Disco was about dressing up
...the list goes on, but the point was a rock statement not a racial one...
It's unfortunate that perceptions of it being a homophobic or racist promotion. I certainly, in hindsight, see that. But at the time those negative feelings were completely off our radar.
The station pioneered a lot of elements that re-enforced the ROCK movement. And I'm sure everyone involved is saddened that it became perceived by some as a culture killer.
Lee Abrams
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I'm late to the party on this but since I was in the thick of it as a consultant, here's what happened.
First, history is a narrative laid upon carefully selected facts that tell different stories. With that as backdrop...
Steve Dahl was a brilliant promoter and disc jockey. He could think up stunts that electrified Chicago. Disco demolition was just one of them. It was more about the fact that disco was getting a lot more attention than rock at the time so the idea of blowing up disco records seems like a good idea. In all my time knowing Steve Dahl or any of the other people involved, there was never anything racist about it. After all, the biggest disco band in the world was the Bee Gees and they were white.
That's another part of the problem. The Bee Gees documentary.
In a carefully selected clip, it showed black records being thrown into a bin to be blown up. However it didn't show that the majority of the records were white. One of the radio guys I worked with for years was standing beside the bin when the records were thrown in and said there were far more by bands like Loverboy and other white rock acts than there were black. His comment was that people simply grabbed any record to throw it in the bin just to see it blowing up. Once again, history is written by the exclusion of facts rather than the inclusion of facts.
Now, let's turn to the question of disco demolition being anti-gay. I was interviewed some years ago by a guy writing a thesis on disco demolition being an anti-gay phenomenon and suggesting that disco backlash was against gays.
We discussed it at length and I was clear that I never saw any evidence of it in the research I was doing at the time. Rather people were reacting against the whole glam and glitz of the scene.
Studio 54 was an exclusionary club that left people out and it was highly connected to disco. It was in the news all the time with people being left on the street because they weren't cool enough or glam enough. People don't like to be left out.
So part of the backlash was against a club scene that made "ordinary" people feel like they could never be part of it - rather than anything to do with gays.
In spite of my observations and strong research to back it up, the writer went on to publish a thesis that distorted what I said, claiming that the anti-disco movement was anti-gay. An example of academic destruction. You can Google it.
Also, during this time a lot of disco radio stations were popping up all over the country. I could see the backlash coming against disco music in all the research I was doing and I spoke in front of the largest conference of disco radio owners in the country, warning them that they may end up with problems. This was within weeks of Steve Dahl's disco demolition. I remember how they laughed out loud. Within a year none of them were on the air.
So, in the interest of setting the record straight, musical trends come and go. If I wanted to push the case, I would say that there is a bias against white males in commercial radio because most of them are pop stations that don't play any rock. Of course, that would be ridiculous. Yet I'm sure someone will figure out a way to claim that it's true.
By the way, I think that the Bee Gees documentary on HBO has restirred the pot. Which is too bad because it's a fabulous piece of entertainment devoid of real politics.
John Parikhal
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Thanks for posting both of these. Amazing how people can twist something to fit their narrative.
I know–with 100% certainty–that Dave Logan and Lee Abrams would have had NOTTTTHHHHHING to do with some sort of racist or homophobic plot. Lee, like me, is just a nice, Jewish kid from Flossmoor, Illinois. And Dave is as count-on-able as they come. They, along with Dahl, were just some young, irreverent rock guys looking to have some fun.
Ultimately, it helped Logan fulfill a lifelong dream, to win one for the Tigers. LOL.
Best regards,
Scott Struber
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Those two contrasting letters regarding Disco Demolition Night are very instructive, and I didn't want to let the moment pass without commentary. I like to say that the difference between conservatives and liberals is that conservatives often don't believe white supremacy is even real, while liberals know full well it is but are in denial about their own role within it.
I have no doubt Steve Dahl was completely blind to the racial and heteronormative undercurrents of the anti-disco movement. Part of what makes whiteness and hetero maleness a form of privilege is that you don't ever have to examine your own motivations and biases. They're just the default of the culture.
But when black people tell you they feel the undercurrent of racism, when gay people tell you they feel the undercurrent of homophobia, it doesn't do to dismiss them as oversensitive. To be a marginalized minority is to be ever-aware of the way the dominant culture suppresses your voice and marginalizes your views and opinions. The fact that suppression is often unconscious doesn't mean it's not there. That the person doing the suppressing is a liberal with a self-image as a non-racist, non-homophobe does not mean their actions can't be racist or homophobic.
It's not an accident the target of the ire was disco, an extremely pluralistic genre that openly celebrated blackness and gayness in an era when both were conspicuously absent from most of the mainstream media.
This is not to condemn Dahl or the other anti-disco showmen of the era. The culture has moved on a lot since 1978 and more and more of us have begun to confront our own unconscious biases and the way we privilege our own viewpoint to the exclusion of others. But never mistake the white cis-het viewpoint for some kind of absolute truth. It's just one version of the truth, albeit the one with the biggest army and the deepest pockets.
Jonathan Steigman
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Whether Steve Dahl intended for Disco Demolition to be racist & homophobic is completely missing the point:
Dahl provided a venue for racists and homophobes to rally. It was a huge mistake.
Do racists know they're racist? Hardly. The culture of the past 100 years has produced racists & homophobes on both sides of the aisle.
Is Steve Dahl a racist/homophobe? Who cares?
Bill Seipel
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Sign me up for #teamVince. I'm relieved to see you would print a letter from someone who points out your dog whistle to your primarily white fan base. As a 13 year old in 1978, I thought disco demolition night was a last gasp from the ancestors of Confederates, before the country moved to the path Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. paved 10 years earlier.
White guys only appreciate black people making music at their nieces and daughters weddings.
Black people who read you know that if Darius Rucker fronted the Red Hot Chili Peppers, they would be called a hip hop group. RHCP can break through with a Stevie Wonder song, while Living Coulour, King's X and Fishbone never got the promotional support they deserved.
Please bring that podcast to fruition.
I will always tell smart people to read you,
Steve Smith
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Revisionist history? I'm sorry, Paul "friend of Steve Dahl's" Natkin, but one of America's biggest actors, Bob Odenkirk, did an episode of Drunk HIstory about this, and took the standard "Disco sucks" perspective. There's many videos of Dahl dogwhistling in interviews about how he shouldn't have to wear glitter to leave the house. Dahl has been pleading and bleating his case that he was just earnestly not into disco for so long, he's the epitome of the "empty vessels make the most noise" idiom. The only revisionist history that happens about the disco demolition is from Dahl and his defenders. Oh, and "He found himself unemployed because of progress so he took up a mantle against something inanimate and abstract instead of adapting" is the origin story for like half of all villains.
Trevor Risk
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Bob, a big segment of music fans dug the dance music trends in the 70s and 80s. The labels, operating true to form, milked the disco style dry, running it-and themselves-into the ground. But throughout the era, there were plenty of alternate listening options for those whose music discovery ability went beyond tuning in the local top-40 station.
To deem someone's creative output unworthy is ignorant. To stage a massive public event encouraging such ignorance is wrongful conduct.
It was a hateful, stupid, racist, homophobic, anti-music, anti-common sense reflection of America's worst. Pigs.
Yesteryear's "Disco Sucks" acolytes are today's Trump voters. Paul Lanning
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When disco happened, my contemporaries and I hated it for a number of reasons, including the dumbing down of the drum parts (I'm a drummer), the lack of guts or soul in the music itself, and disco's extolling the dancing/dancers to the exclusion of the musicians. I remember an article in People Magazine around 1979 that made that very point, i.e., that the dancers were the stars, and not the musicians, to the point where the live concert business was suffering.
Never once did my friends and I even consider a racist or homophobic reason for hating the disco genre. After all, blues, R&B and rock owe their existence directly to the Black community that essentially created it. Also, it might be noted that the Bee Gees, undeniably -- however reluctantly -- the poster child group of Disco, were White and straight.
Now, I cannot attest to what my African-American friends and associates thought of Disco Demolition or anti-disco sentiments at the time, but I never heard or saw any hint of this -- or a homophobic -- viewpoint at the time. In fact, the first time such a notion has been asserted, to my knowledge, was in the Bee Gees documentary.
As a historian by education, I have always been wary of revisionism, i.e., altering historical analysis or conclusions to fit a current trend or fad. Without disrespecting Vince Lawrence, it seems to me as if his recollection of that period is revisionism, pure and simple.
Douglas Weinstein
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Woah man did that dude piss me off.
The first disco record I heard was coming out of a stereo in my house. I had no idea who the artist was. If they were black, gay or from New Zealand. It was Fly Robin Fly and the sound of that record turned my stomach.
I worked retail in Bklyn, on Kings Highway, the disco capital of the US back then, during that era and found records like Push Push In The Bush, YMCA, Take The Time etc to be vapid, sometimes sexist and unlistenable.
You'll find at least a half a dozen Donna Summer tracks in my phone.
Larry Tepper
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Here's how history works. It doesn't matter how straight white guys saw it. It matters how Black and Gay people saw it.
Seek to understand.
Bryson Jones
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I'm with Vince. I also saw it as racist and homophobic and I happen to be white and straight.
Frank Malfitano
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I am born, raised and living in Puerto Rico.
Back in the 70's I was into Salsa, Rock and Jazz.
Could not stand Disco. Disco Demolition was not "racist" to me.
I would much rather listen to Freddie Hubbard or George Benson, both black.
Not to mention all the Salsa guys…or the Blues guys behind Rock.
Joey Sala
San Juan, PR
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Good Day Bob,
I really don't know how society moves forward
as one. We can't agree on facts, we can't agree on the past, and we definitely can't agree on how to proceed in the future.
I wasn't at disco demolition night as I was only 3 at the time, and have never lived in Chicago either. Amazing that the organizers of the event see it one way and some other guy who claims to have been there that night sees it completely differently. I don't make a habit of calling people liars without evidence so I tend to believe Paul Natkin's account. I feel Mr. Lawrence lost a great deal of credibility as soon as he made a not so subtle plea for public exposure at your expense.
At the end of the day I suppose my opinion isn't all that relevant on this matter, but what a depressing reality that one man's reaction to having lost his job because of a segment of his industry that he strongly disliked for musical taste reasons has been twisted into him being a racist and homophobe. I never knew the guy so I can't comment on his personal views, but isn't it possible that he just hated disco music? I hate rap music - no matter what color the rapper. My ears just hate the sound - nothing more, nothing less. I prefer guitars, real drums played by a drummer, melody sung by someone who can sing, and bass mixed in at the appropriate level. Doesn't make me a racist.
Merry Christmas and Happy Hanukkah, bro.
Tim W
in Calgary
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Bob, Paul Natkin is one of the great rock photographers, based in Chicago. I'd love for you to do a post about rock photographers and seek out their perspectives on the music of the 60s, 70s and the 80s.
I would agree that Dahl did not promote the night at Comiskey as anything but a night to celebrate rock and roll by destroying disco records. However, there were many in the audience and in general who hated disco because of the audience it attracted: people of color and non-heterosexual.
Mark Guncheon
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Excellent note from Chicago's great photographer Paul Natkin.
He's absolutely right on every point. I was one of the crazed teenagers on the field, rock and roll Kid listening to The Loop FM 98.
We spent most of the time before the game getting lubricated and getting our smoke on for the night. I think we just enjoyed running around the field for kicks, but when a 12-inch record started flying past my head by inches, I scurried back to the lower-level stands to watch the rest. Plenty of footage on YouTube will show you what that action was like that night!
Dfactor Dave
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I remember when I first heard the 12" disco remix of Blondie's "Heart of Glass" and thinking, "uh-oh, we're fucked."
And lo and behold "Da Ya Think I'm Sexy" came along.
Dave Curtis
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I was a 13 year old Cubs fan at the time and from my suburban Chicago seat, I was mostly glad to see Comiskey Park get trashed. I was definitely a Loop listener and Steve Dahl fan and had no racial animosity. Probably naive at the time.
Take care!
Sam Schauer
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Some of us hated disco because we thought that compared to funk, soul and jazz it sounded like insipid crap played by machines, and we were too insecure and self-conscious to let loose & party down with the folks who got off on it - regardless of their skin color or sexual orientation. But hey, I'm glad that many people found joy and comfort in Gloria Gaynor's "I Will Survive".
For me, it was never about the people. The music just left me cold.
Joe Paulino
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This is a great conversation. Until today I never considered the possibility that the disco demolition stunt was racist, but that may be my own ignorance. I guess I never considered disco to be race-specific.
Bird
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Agree with you and Paul. Nice to share the two perspectives.
Kyle J. Ferraro
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Far too often white people don't "see" things as racist. It's how we got to this moment.
Peter Buffett
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Once again, a clear picture of America today. Two diametrically opposed takes on the same event.
David Rubin
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As someone your age, I remember being disappointed that disco was becoming so popular at the expense of rock. I vaguely remember something about disco demolition. I never heard of Steve Dahl before but I understand his thinking. And DJs are always out there and promoting stuff. so if you have a gimmick like blowing up a record to get people's attention and it works, you keep doing it.
I was saddened that rock was being replaced. Why are all these people liking this music? Didn't matter if it was good, bad, whatever. It was taking over from the rock music that I loved.
And as a cover band musician, we sure as hell learned disco songs. ( I did like Richard Finch's bass lines on KC songs).
Same thing with Hip Hop today, replacing what came before it. And something new will replace hip hop some day.
Dale Janus
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merry hanukkah, xmas, and happy safe new year..
wow, u got thrown right in the eye of the hurricane.
no matter what you say, peoples perception of events,
thru the lens of years, will never line up.
our reality vs.vince's realty will never line up.
nothing you can say about innocence etc
will ever be acknowledged.
\the cancel button is in front of U.
i feel for you, and hope you stay BOB.
you r a solid caring human. thats all that matters.
stay safe, and warm..
with all my respect,
marc brickman
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Very interesting, contrasting views.
It may not have been a racist homophobic thing, but I liked Disco in the late 1970s, Donna Summer, and some others, and thought the whining of the rock people was annoying. Yes, Disco is very seasy to do badly, and that is partly why some disliked it, and its minimal lyrics, something I never liked about it, made it sound plastic at times, but rock is not much better. There is the term three-chord rock and all that screaming. It's sad you can't like both genres for the unique contributions to American culture that they are.
Best
David
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Hello, my name is Jim Marcus. As a member of the Box Boys and Die Warzau, I was part of the dance music scene here in Chicago, both house and industrial. I've continuously worked here as a remixer, engineer, producer, artist, etc. since the early 80's and when Disco Demolition happened I was a young session musician. As an LGBTQ person myself, it was clear exactly from what perspective this event happened and I very much saw the same thing Vince Lawrence did.
I remember sitting with friends that night in the studio and feeling unsafe in my own city. It seemed like the entire city had decided what it thought about the black and gay musicians that had just begun to gain acceptance on the air. Steve Dahl himself talked about how uncomfortable he was in clubs, as a heterosexual male, how he felt out of his element. His obvious discomfort at being around gay people was amplified in his followers, and that kind of othering of LGBTQ people was pervasive at the event.
It seems easy to us now to look back and call out what is Disco and what wasn't, the truth is that many of the records that were burned that night were just records from black artists. And much of the vitriol was aimed squarely at the fluid, gender playful, disco fans and artists who were finally finding a way to be themselves ion public.
If you are not gay, trans, bisexual, etc. you may have no idea what freedoms Disco offered people. Steve Dahl wrote about intimidation and disenfranchisement when walking into a dance club, but never considered for a moment that the people at home in that club were HONESTLY intimidated and disenfranchised by a community that saw policemen sit in their cars while gay and trans people were beaten in the streets.
If Dahl himself wants to deny that he was racist or homophobic, I would love to see him come to it honestly, by asking himself why he stood there in front of thousands of, nearly to the person, white straight males, screaming and circulating the message. He can maybe explain why he didn't hear what they screamed back. Because I guarantee you that those of us in the city who were different, gay, trans, black, latino, we got the message loud and clear.
Regards,
Jim Marcus
____________________________________
I commend you for posting these two opposing views, but I believe anyone of good faith and any conscience whatsoever must admit that it's Vince Lawrence's perspective that is the correct one.
Racism and xenophobia is so intrinsic to the very genesis and fabric of this country that all of us white men, in particular, even those among us who try and wish to be allies can't help but suffer from living within the limited perspective of simply being white men.
Any white person who denies that simple and obvious phenomenon or that disco hatred was clearly just thinly veiled hatred for the "other", black and gay people is utterly deluding themselves, which is itself racist and xenophobic as hell! It's akin to Trump voters denying their obvious racism and screaming about economic anxiety as they adorn their $80k pickup trucks with a million MAGA flags and brandish their $2k AR-15s demanding haircuts. They're only fooling fools.
I enjoyed the Bee Gees documentary immensely and was actually tempted to respond vociferously about how wrong and obviously biased your recollection of the disco demolition was, but Vincent's response was so much more powerful, not just because he was there and in the film, but because he has the lifetime experience of systemic racism that us white guys NEVER will.
Thank you Vince for setting the record straight! Anyone who disagrees is telling on themselves.
I'd love to hear Vincent absolutely demolish Steve Dahl's dim white guy perspective, again, so I'm hoping Vincent's suggestion of a podcast can happen. More people need to be taught how deep is their hate before they can understand how deep their love could and should be.
And I think the Bee Gees would agree.
Martin Ferrini
____________________________________
Steve Dahl was a fat bastard socially inept and couldn't get laid even if he had speed boat on Gilligan's Island.
I am not going to get into the "hemming and hawing" ...heres the bottom.line ...
The major label promotion people hated and I do mean hated disco ( the lifestyle and the music ) . They especially hated that all the hot chicks and the best drugs were ready available in a club where they just did not fit in . They hated that the PDs in their respective markets ( many of which were closet gay ) were finding songs on their respective labels that weren't "priorities " and adding them with nothing more than a " by the way we are adding song x I heard it at a disco over the weekend ". The label reps thought disco was a gay thing and anybody whom liked it was gay as well . I know this to be 100% true because I went thru it whn I moved from being the RFC / WB East Coast Dance Music Rep to joining Atlantic as the Boston Rep. . Shit ..I got fired for getting a song I liked added at 4 Boston stations. Stacy Lattisaw " Let Me Be Your Angle " ...was not a priority and was not on Atlantic radar. Vince Feracci called me that Tuesday afternoon " If you want to get records played at radio that you like you should get a job at radio .. YOURE FIRED !!" I took Vince advise ....
I became Sunny Joe Whites Asst MD then MD at Kiss 108 .
Back to Dahl . This too I know to be a fact ..... the record companies drop shipped 1000s of records ( cutouts ) to Chicago because 90% of the morons he reached didnt hve disco records in their collection to blow up.
Bottom Line : before disco clubs were 100% segregated ....white , black,gay ,straight ' hispanic .... the Disco brought us all together under one roof... I saw the desegregation happen..I was part of it ...
It was wonderful !!!
Joey Carvello
Billboard Disco Deejay Of The Year 1978 /Boston
____________________________________
I was at the ballgame. at the time i was a 21 white kid from the suburbs of NYC, I was not really a fan of disco, but i did not go to protest music, hell I had been to disco's to meet girls, it was a right of passage in the late 70's.
I was visiting my sister in Chicago and was told about the event at a local bar. I attended because I am a huge baseball fan and a double header made sense. I paid full price for good box seats. Most of the people that stormed the field had general admission as the promotion was bring a disco record to plow up between games and you get in with GA seats for 98 cents ( station # was 98 point something FM )
The demonstration was a dud, The records were put into a large contained box in center field, the all you saw was smoke. Steve Dahl was kind of funny until the crowd started to boo. He was dressed up in a old army jacket and helmet, like he was protesting Viet Nam or something.
The crowd was acting up during the first game, those that could not get the GA tickets and still had their records were using them as frisbee's. I know the Detroit third baseman was wearing a batting helmet while fielding, he was quoted in the news defending disco music before the game.
I for one was not happy when the crowd ran ointo the field, tore up the infield, ripped the bases out and would not leave. I was really not happy when the second game was forfeited. The White Sox owner announced any valid ticket could be used for another game, like a rainout. I was leaving Chicago before the next home game, so i gave my ticket to my sister to give out.
In retrospect I was witness to history first hand, had a story to tell. At the time i thought it was a dumb idea that went wrong.
Tom Melle
____________________________________
Two great letters providing a very different perspective on this unique event in my home town.
I did not attend the game. I was a Cubs fan living on the southside (Sox Country). I was 19 in 1978, a white kid from an immigrant family, first year dating my wife of 34 years, the most beautiful woman and only Cuban I had ever met. Chicago was and still is a highly segregated city, and as in 1978 remains racist. However, for some reason it never occured to me that others would have an issue with my choice of spouse. My wife was also an immigrant, and despite growing up much of her childhood and young adult life in Chicago she swears she never experienced racism. Hard to believe given the tough neighborhoods we lived in, schools we attended, but that is her perspective and I know she believes it.
I didn't march with Dr. King, I was only a child when he and 20,000 (whites, blacks, browns, nuns, priests, rabbis, business leaders, politicians, etc.) locked arm-in-arm proudly marched down California Ave to Marquette Park on the southside of Chicago. However, I did view the event from the safety of my best friend's front porch (later County District Attorney) and it was not a pretty sight. I haven't lived in Chicago for some 35 years, but spent half my time working there during the last 9 years. It certainly has improved over the years, but there's much more work to do.
I listened to Steve because I was into Classic Rock and he had a good shtick with his side-kick Gary...of course at the time it was just Rock, not yet Classic...but it never occured to me then or until you brought it up that it was some kind of racist or homophobic event. Couldn't walk a block in Chicago without running into a racist or homophobic, but I knew plenty of folks that went to the event and talked about it for years afterwards and none of us had that angle. The big news then and still now is that the Sox forfeited a game. And if I recall it was the effective end of Steve's career, such as it was.
Bill Veeck, Sox owner, was the master of promotion and he was the furthest thing from a racist...he was an upstanding guy...so I understand why no one would have associated Bill with promoting such an event.
Had I walked in different shoes back then, black or gay, I suspect I too would've had an entire different view and I appreciate the comments from Mr. Lawrence. Different people experiencing the same event, living at the same time, in the same place, and with different recollections. And all very real, no doubt.
Thanks for sharing their letters.
E Kelly
____________________________________
Thank you for presenting e-mails of both perspectives (Vince Lawrence and Paul Natkin). My heart still races from the thought of the Disco Demolition. I was 10 years old and I remember the spray painted buildings with Disco Sucks and the light posts carved with WBLS - We Black Love Sh*t . WBLS was top R&B Station. Mr. Natkin may have not realized that the actions were racist or homophobic but it was. The ramifications of those actions were felt throughout black neighborhoods. It was a direct attack on the music we loved and it caused a divide.
Thanks for reading.
Jeff James
____________________________________
it's likely bordering on the absurd levels of obvious to say no one care what I think about race. Certainly, as a middle-aged white dude, I have very little to offer except my own experience. It may be useful.
I was anti-disco. I had no idea at the time this position was infused with race. I never thought Stevie Wonder, Earth Wind and Fire, or Al Green were disco. I loved those artists then as I do now. We can debate the Bee Gees, but history has changed my thinking about the demolition.
I live in the south and lack a lot of the self-loathing white guilt that I probably should feel. At the same time, I'm all about tearing down the statues of the traders of the confederacy and I don't care about the rebel flag one way or the other. Burn it. I'll hand you a match. Fly it behind your truck. I'll thank you silently for outing yourself as an asshole.
What I do care about is music. I saw this interview https://youtu.be/dTvNjPFjlNE?t=3301 with Roger Joseph Manning Jr. and it literally turned me 180 degrees on Saturday Night Fever and disco in general. The Bee Gees doc did a lot to affirm my newfound appreciation for what they accomplished in the mid 70's in Miami.
In the clear light of history and hindsight, yea, the Disco demolition was a racist act. I'm pretty sure the people that came up with the idea weren't racist. What all this has taught me in retrospect is that when it comes to prejudice, intent is irrelevant. Very few people mean to be racist or prejudice. We just are, unless we consciously review our thoughts and actions and screen for it. Even then, we often miss. We're human.
In July 1979, I wouldn't have thought twice about blowing up bad dance records (or bad rock records for that matter) and never considered race. Blowing shit up is awesome. Why I never thought in the '90s to suggest that a station blow up hair metal bands is beyond me. The argument that "it's been done" would have been preposterous on its face. We re-did every successful promotion over and over. Hair metal, as a genre, deserved every gram of explosive disco ever got. So there you have it. Guilty.
Manning of course is correct. Albhy Galuten is an undeniable genius. The Cocteau Twins, Blue Nile, and the Beastie Boys all have proven me wrong about the legitimacy of loops and drum machines.
Sure, I still hate Roland 808 high-hats, but I get Migos. Are Roland 808's cultural signaling? Hell if I know. Probably. So what? Yes, I realize now I was racist and homophobic about Disco. There is no one to forgive me but myself and there is no one to apologize to for my ignorance. This is the problem of race in our time. We can be nice. We can ally. We can protest, but we cannot fix what was done. All we can do face our miserable failings and work for better tomorrow.
Perhaps we can reconsider the music we missed, too. There's always that.
Tom Barnes
____________________________________
I'm waiting for what, I'm sure, will be an interesting and polarized reaction to Disco Demolition and figured I'd add my account of that night to the forthcoming scrum.
Full disclosure: I've known Steve Dahl for almost 45 years and in fact, was his roommate in Detroit when we first met. So, yep, we've been friends for a long, long time.
Back in July 1979, I was scheduled to fly to Chicago to do a presentation at the MCA Records Distribution offices for one of the bands I was managing. I lived in LA at the time. So Steve offered to let me stay with him and Janet (Steve's wife) while I was in town. "But," Steve told me, "you may wanna come in a couple of days earlier, because we're doing this promotion that might be interesting." He laid out the plans, but really had no idea how it would go. The way he convinced me to come was the game(s): A doubleheader between the ChiSox and Tigers. I'm a dyed in the wool Tigers fan.
Now, it might be helpful to elaborate here about something that Paul Natkin referenced in an earlier email to you. That is, what was the partial genesis for Steve's "anti-disco" attitude. During his years in Detroit, Steve's popularity skyrocketed as the morning air personality at Rock Radio AORs WABX and subsequently WWWW (W4). At the time there was even a third AOR station in the market—WRIF. WRIF was a part of the ABC Radio Network's chain of Album Rock stations, which included several others like KLOS (LA). Steve was becoming quite a star in Detroit, so ABC decided to back the truck up to Steve's door, dump a bunch of money, and hire him. But to go to their Chicago AOR station, WDAI. Their strategy was twofold: (1) Bring Steve to Chicago to bolster their struggling station, WDAI, and (2) get him the hell outta Detroit where he was kicking WRIF's ass.
Shortly after arriving in Chicago (within months), WDAI flipped formats from Rock to DISCO and canned Dahl. For Steve, shock and anger ensued. And that's when WLUP (The Loop) swooped in and hired him.
As for that night at Comiskey Park, it was one of the most insane events I've ever experienced. When we pulled into Comiskey's parking lot, there were literally thousands of people milling around. The game was sold out (50,000) and they couldn't get in. Steve looked at me and said, "I think this thing is gonna be bigger than we thought." No kidding. WLUP had a private press box right next to both the White Sox and Tigers broadcast booths, so we all had a really good view of the insanity. After the first game, a huge pile of records were set up and Steve came out. The crowd went bananas—many having kept their 12" vinyl and throwing them around like frisbees. When the explosion blew up, the crowd erupted and flooded the ball field. Absolutely burying Steve. We honestly feared for the guy's life. Scary.
Of course, the doubleheader's second game was canceled. And for what it's worth, after that night Steve Dahl became a huge, iconic and enduring celebrity in Chicago.
I expect most of your readers will be addressing the question of racism and homophobia, and rightfully so. Was that the intent of WLUP, the Chicago White Sox or Steve Dahl? I honestly do not think so. However, it's obvious that the event has had ramifications over the years that have proven unsettling, upsetting and even emblematic of some of the deepest problems that our nation confronts. Lord knows the last four years' Administration here in the US have shown us that we have a very long ways to go.
PS. One anecdote (out of so many). Being a huge baseball fan, I poked my head into the teams' broadcast booths where there were guys like Al Kaline doing the game. The White Sox analyst at the time was Jimmy Piersall, a former outfielder who was infamous for his genuinely bizarre antics on the playing field, as well as the movie based on his life, "Fear Strikes Out." Well, after the explosion, he stormed into The Loop's press box and grabbed me (of all people) by the collar, screaming at me as he reared back to punch me in the face! Fortunately Comiskey Park Security quietly intervened.
Anyway, that's some of my Disco Demolition experience, Bob.
There's so much more, but I'm tired of typing!
Play ball!
And Happy Holidays.
Hugh Surratt
____________________________________
Boy- this one is out of control! I have known Steve Dahl
for +/- 40 years. Disco Demolition was never intended to
be political, racial, or for that matter- even serious.
It was for people who suddenly were forced to listen to nothing but Disco on the radio- whether they liked it or not.
Steve Dahl still lives in Chicago.
He has been on the radio his whole life.
He talks about what ever is going on- with no judgement.
I have never heard him radicalize about anything.
The only agenda I have ever heard from him on the air
is common sense.
Honest!
Joe Walsh
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Me On Live From Nerdville
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I love Joe, he's totally open and down to earth. Herein we discuss all kinds of issues relating to the music business. Yes, I am wary of self-promotion, but by watching/listening to this you'll be informed of many of my music business insights, and isn't that why most of you are subscribing anyway?
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I love Joe, he's totally open and down to earth. Herein we discuss all kinds of issues relating to the music business. Yes, I am wary of self-promotion, but by watching/listening to this you'll be informed of many of my music business insights, and isn't that why most of you are subscribing anyway?
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Tuesday 22 December 2020
The Beatles Sneak Peek
https://bit.ly/2WCx4SD
UTTERLY ASTOUNDING!
We forget the Beatles were a band. Of twentysomethings. United by the music. Which they loved playing.
I don't know if your inbox has been blowing up with this, but mine certainly has. Showing the power of virality. It seeps through society, slowly, and when it hits you and you click and you start to smile you feel both an individual and part of something greater than yourself, that was the power of the Beatles, that is the power of music.
Too much of the internet is about manipulation. Those with the greatest power are the worst. Just try to delete your account on Facebook. Purveyors are constantly shoving stuff down our throats. First, with a scorched earth publicity campaign, followed up by all kinds of online shenanigans, trying to enlist the hoi polloi to spread the word, to the point where most people ignore hype these days. Talk about being out of touch with the public, did you see the "Wonder Woman" theatrical grosses in Europe? A pittance! No one wants to go to the damn movie theatre, except those not wearing masks who believe they're immune, and there are not enough of those people to sustain all these businesses bitching that they're being hobbled by the government. So, you've got the movie business trying to hold back the sands of time, trying to keep windows in force when you're lucky if anyone is paying attention at all, when you need to hoover up the cash immediately, legs are shorter than ever, get it now, do it now. And chances are your project is a stiff, most are. The key is to get right back in the game, as opposed to promoting that which people do not want. You're a hit or a zit in internet culture, and almost nothing is a hit, and too many substandard products are vying for attention, and then you come across this clip from Peter Jackson's Beatles movie.
I'll admit, I didn't immediately click. I'm jaded. Is there anything new under the sun? The Beatles have been ravaging and raping their past for far too long. The insidious remixes, momentary dashes for cash...what I'm worried about in the future is these third-class takes will become the standard, the ones everybody knows, and they're tripe. Do you have any idea what makes a record a hit? Change one little element and oftentimes you ruin it. To create a hit, everything's got to line up...the song, the playing, the singing, the engineering, the mix... And Geoff Emerick was one of the greats, he had history with the band to boot. Do you think he mixed these records willy-nilly? Of course not, he even told me face to face that the stereo mix of "Sgt. Pepper" was not an afterthought, but never let the truth get in the way of a good story.
And film is truth. Image is truth. You believe what your eyes see. Well, you used to, before manipulation, but I didn't see any here, watching on my 5k iMac I felt like the sixties were happening right now, it wasn't nostalgia, the Beatles were positively alive, as a group, and I was in the studio with them!
Now the great thing about this clip is the lack of flourish, the lack of seasoning, the lack of shining up. Now, in this all too fake culture, we appreciate, cling to, honesty, directness. When Peter Jackson looks into the camera and talks...you feel like he's speaking directly to you, as if you were in the cutting room and he was setting you up to watch footage on a computer monitor. And he didn't don makeup, he was wearing shorts, he was a creator, not a star, someone like you and me but with a hell of a lot more on his resumé.
Then you see all the guitars. People today have no idea what gearheads we were back then. In an era where electronic gear was not de rigueur, all we had were transistor radios and record players. Guitars were exotic. We learned all the brand names, we could tell what was what by its shape, and it started with the Beatles...a Rickenbacker?
Ringo Starr is still alive, spry and active. We've forgotten that he was once just a young man, barely out of boyhood.
And then when we see/hear John Lennon reading from the paper in that voice, the one we know so well from the intro to "Two of Us"...WHEW, the record comes alive! We've been accustomed to the records for so long we've forgotten that human beings made them, with a hell of a lot less sophisticated equipment than today, and that they were inventing it as they went, there were not well-worn footsteps to follow.
And they're having so much FUN!
And then they're playing together as a BAND! For decades the focus has been on the breakup, the feuds, but here they are all together, SMILING!
And playing. They know how to do it, they've been doing it for years!
And then Lennon tapping his hand on the strings of his guitar...
Then the studio equipment, how ancient, but they got this sound down.
And then Linda and Yoko are so YOUNG, and so ALIVE! You can see the appeal of each of them, before they were dragged through the mud.
Then the band listening to the playback... The dream used to be to be in the studio, you needed access, you had none, that's where the magic was created!
And Billy Preston and George Martin, both so young, both now dead.
But the revelation is John Lennon. His reputation has been dragged through the mud, he's seen now as an angry young man, oftentimes dour, in competition with Paul. But here he's jumping around and smiling and involved, not detached, he's totally different from the legend that's been established, he's once again a musician, a creator, an experimenter, who's also sometimes an imp, the mischievous one who refused to follow norms, who questioned authority. WHEW!
And now you can see why the sixties were so great. It was about liberation! Today too many want to bring us back to a theoretical past that never existed. Where we were all prim and proper, obeyed the rules and were good citizens. But that's not how it WAS! We were testing limits, and we were led first and foremost by the Beatles, who kept pushing the envelope, getting us to question who we were, what we believed, how we dressed, everything was up for grabs, the sky was the limit.
Today "musicians" are "brands." In many cases literally, their music/fame is just a jumping off point to sell you crap. Not only perfume and apparel, but multiple album covers and merchandise, they can't stop milking fans, meanwhile the media doubles down and says it's all right, but let's not forget in the sixties the media was CLUELESS! In order to know what was going on you had to tune in to the radio and listen to the music. There was something happening there, and it certainly wasn't exactly clear.
Same deal today. No one knows what's really going on. Let's start at the top, with the presidential election, the pollsters got it so wrong that they're not even weighing in on the Georgia senatorial elections, we've learned not to trust them.
The only way you know what is going on is by firing up your computer, whether it be a desktop, laptop or the phone in your hand. Meanwhile, the oldsters can't stop decrying them, lauding physical books, like you can't read on a screen, which people are doing all day, saying we're spending too much time in front of screens when the truth is THAT IS WHERE IT'S HAPPENING! It's akin to the parents of the sixties telling their kids to turn off that damn music, the music that's still alive today.
Most definitely in this clip.
These are real human beings, who followed the sound, for years before they got any recognition. And when they finally got in the studio they kept expanding the boundaries, they did not want to be in stasis, do what was expected of them, they wanted to get turned on themselves, they knew the result would turn on their audience.
They may not have gone on tour, but they still loved to play. And create. That was the essence. They were still musicians, they were still a band, that came first, the pronouncements, the controversies, those were all secondary to the music.
And this clip is evidence. Show it to youngsters and they'll feel it, show it to ANYBODY and they'll feel it. That was the power, that was the draw, who in hell could be exposed to the Beatles and want to work at a bank, play it safe? Never forget, Steve Jobs was a big Beatles fan.
But Steve Jobs is already fading into history. But not the Beatles. Music is set in amber, it cannot be superseded with a faster chip, get it right and it lasts. But, more than five decades later we've forgotten the genesis, we're so detached from what once was that we're influenced by the penumbra as opposed to the essence. But Peter Jackson's film brings us right back.
GET BACK HOME LORETTA!
UTTERLY ASTOUNDING!
We forget the Beatles were a band. Of twentysomethings. United by the music. Which they loved playing.
I don't know if your inbox has been blowing up with this, but mine certainly has. Showing the power of virality. It seeps through society, slowly, and when it hits you and you click and you start to smile you feel both an individual and part of something greater than yourself, that was the power of the Beatles, that is the power of music.
Too much of the internet is about manipulation. Those with the greatest power are the worst. Just try to delete your account on Facebook. Purveyors are constantly shoving stuff down our throats. First, with a scorched earth publicity campaign, followed up by all kinds of online shenanigans, trying to enlist the hoi polloi to spread the word, to the point where most people ignore hype these days. Talk about being out of touch with the public, did you see the "Wonder Woman" theatrical grosses in Europe? A pittance! No one wants to go to the damn movie theatre, except those not wearing masks who believe they're immune, and there are not enough of those people to sustain all these businesses bitching that they're being hobbled by the government. So, you've got the movie business trying to hold back the sands of time, trying to keep windows in force when you're lucky if anyone is paying attention at all, when you need to hoover up the cash immediately, legs are shorter than ever, get it now, do it now. And chances are your project is a stiff, most are. The key is to get right back in the game, as opposed to promoting that which people do not want. You're a hit or a zit in internet culture, and almost nothing is a hit, and too many substandard products are vying for attention, and then you come across this clip from Peter Jackson's Beatles movie.
I'll admit, I didn't immediately click. I'm jaded. Is there anything new under the sun? The Beatles have been ravaging and raping their past for far too long. The insidious remixes, momentary dashes for cash...what I'm worried about in the future is these third-class takes will become the standard, the ones everybody knows, and they're tripe. Do you have any idea what makes a record a hit? Change one little element and oftentimes you ruin it. To create a hit, everything's got to line up...the song, the playing, the singing, the engineering, the mix... And Geoff Emerick was one of the greats, he had history with the band to boot. Do you think he mixed these records willy-nilly? Of course not, he even told me face to face that the stereo mix of "Sgt. Pepper" was not an afterthought, but never let the truth get in the way of a good story.
And film is truth. Image is truth. You believe what your eyes see. Well, you used to, before manipulation, but I didn't see any here, watching on my 5k iMac I felt like the sixties were happening right now, it wasn't nostalgia, the Beatles were positively alive, as a group, and I was in the studio with them!
Now the great thing about this clip is the lack of flourish, the lack of seasoning, the lack of shining up. Now, in this all too fake culture, we appreciate, cling to, honesty, directness. When Peter Jackson looks into the camera and talks...you feel like he's speaking directly to you, as if you were in the cutting room and he was setting you up to watch footage on a computer monitor. And he didn't don makeup, he was wearing shorts, he was a creator, not a star, someone like you and me but with a hell of a lot more on his resumé.
Then you see all the guitars. People today have no idea what gearheads we were back then. In an era where electronic gear was not de rigueur, all we had were transistor radios and record players. Guitars were exotic. We learned all the brand names, we could tell what was what by its shape, and it started with the Beatles...a Rickenbacker?
Ringo Starr is still alive, spry and active. We've forgotten that he was once just a young man, barely out of boyhood.
And then when we see/hear John Lennon reading from the paper in that voice, the one we know so well from the intro to "Two of Us"...WHEW, the record comes alive! We've been accustomed to the records for so long we've forgotten that human beings made them, with a hell of a lot less sophisticated equipment than today, and that they were inventing it as they went, there were not well-worn footsteps to follow.
And they're having so much FUN!
And then they're playing together as a BAND! For decades the focus has been on the breakup, the feuds, but here they are all together, SMILING!
And playing. They know how to do it, they've been doing it for years!
And then Lennon tapping his hand on the strings of his guitar...
Then the studio equipment, how ancient, but they got this sound down.
And then Linda and Yoko are so YOUNG, and so ALIVE! You can see the appeal of each of them, before they were dragged through the mud.
Then the band listening to the playback... The dream used to be to be in the studio, you needed access, you had none, that's where the magic was created!
And Billy Preston and George Martin, both so young, both now dead.
But the revelation is John Lennon. His reputation has been dragged through the mud, he's seen now as an angry young man, oftentimes dour, in competition with Paul. But here he's jumping around and smiling and involved, not detached, he's totally different from the legend that's been established, he's once again a musician, a creator, an experimenter, who's also sometimes an imp, the mischievous one who refused to follow norms, who questioned authority. WHEW!
And now you can see why the sixties were so great. It was about liberation! Today too many want to bring us back to a theoretical past that never existed. Where we were all prim and proper, obeyed the rules and were good citizens. But that's not how it WAS! We were testing limits, and we were led first and foremost by the Beatles, who kept pushing the envelope, getting us to question who we were, what we believed, how we dressed, everything was up for grabs, the sky was the limit.
Today "musicians" are "brands." In many cases literally, their music/fame is just a jumping off point to sell you crap. Not only perfume and apparel, but multiple album covers and merchandise, they can't stop milking fans, meanwhile the media doubles down and says it's all right, but let's not forget in the sixties the media was CLUELESS! In order to know what was going on you had to tune in to the radio and listen to the music. There was something happening there, and it certainly wasn't exactly clear.
Same deal today. No one knows what's really going on. Let's start at the top, with the presidential election, the pollsters got it so wrong that they're not even weighing in on the Georgia senatorial elections, we've learned not to trust them.
The only way you know what is going on is by firing up your computer, whether it be a desktop, laptop or the phone in your hand. Meanwhile, the oldsters can't stop decrying them, lauding physical books, like you can't read on a screen, which people are doing all day, saying we're spending too much time in front of screens when the truth is THAT IS WHERE IT'S HAPPENING! It's akin to the parents of the sixties telling their kids to turn off that damn music, the music that's still alive today.
Most definitely in this clip.
These are real human beings, who followed the sound, for years before they got any recognition. And when they finally got in the studio they kept expanding the boundaries, they did not want to be in stasis, do what was expected of them, they wanted to get turned on themselves, they knew the result would turn on their audience.
They may not have gone on tour, but they still loved to play. And create. That was the essence. They were still musicians, they were still a band, that came first, the pronouncements, the controversies, those were all secondary to the music.
And this clip is evidence. Show it to youngsters and they'll feel it, show it to ANYBODY and they'll feel it. That was the power, that was the draw, who in hell could be exposed to the Beatles and want to work at a bank, play it safe? Never forget, Steve Jobs was a big Beatles fan.
But Steve Jobs is already fading into history. But not the Beatles. Music is set in amber, it cannot be superseded with a faster chip, get it right and it lasts. But, more than five decades later we've forgotten the genesis, we're so detached from what once was that we're influenced by the penumbra as opposed to the essence. But Peter Jackson's film brings us right back.
GET BACK HOME LORETTA!
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Re-The Crystal Ship
I was in college at Cal State Long Beach when my best buddy invited me to go to San Francisco with him to do the equipment for the doors at the Avalon. I was going to college for one reason, to avoid the draft. That weekend the doors offered me a summer job to be their roadie. I accepted. At the end of the summer I tried to quit in order to stay in college but they convinced me that they would only work weekends and I could do both. I ended up dropping nine units and getting a D and an F in the other six.
Rich Linnell and I promoted our first concert of the doors at Long Beach State in the gym. In order to get a venue on campus we had to affiliate with an on-campus organization. We chose the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee and paid them 5% of the gross. We held the record for paying the doors the most money for at least the next six months when their career was exploding.
Three weeks later they offered me the job of being the manager and I said I could only do it if I could find a way to beat the draft. They agreed to pay all the expenses so I went to the woman we worked with at SNCC, and she referred me to a William Smith draft lawyer specialist.
Long story short, it worked. But I really thought I was a conscientious objector and spent months agonizing over whether I would return to Canada in order to not have to go kill people.
Cut to 11 years later when George Steele and I go to San Francisco to see a rough cut of "Apocalypse now" at Francis Ford Coppola's house in San Francisco. I was completely destroyed by the film and how it resonated with the choices I've made in my life.I could barely walk out of the screening room. Luckily they provided a barrel tasting of Mr. Coppola's new venture in making wine. It was a turning point for me, and I have to agree with you it was a turning point for the doors.
Bill Siddons
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Loved your latest, about THE DOORS & MORRISON. I too, am a first generation DOORS fanatic. (Bill Mumy sent me your article. I'm his partner "Artie Barnes", from our duo Barnes & Barnes).
Mumy & I saw The Doors live 3 times, once in the front row of the L.A. Aquarius Theatre show #1, 1969. Ahhh, sweet youth. Jim looked into our eyes. That's burned into my soul forever... Like I just told Mumy, I knew the Doors were special and eternal then, in 1967, and it has stayed true for the last 53 years. And now as I'm getting "old", and when I'm gone, like you say, the Doors will still be entrancing generations to come. Jim was a "God".... Mumy talked to him in an elevator in 1970, as I'm sure he's told you. I'm STILL jealous! Thru my being in the music biz, I became friendly with Manzarek. He was always nice to me, even as a 19 year old pimple faced kid, when I would run into him around town. Then we got friendly, and it was a true treat to have known him better. I went to his house, he was supposed to come over to my house, 'cuz I might have been able to get him a record deal in 1991, but I chickened out in making that happen..... That's something I regret not pushing harder to happen... My wife was a Sr. VP at a few major labels back in the day..
Anyway, just thought I'd say hi, well done on your story. The Doors have been with me daily since 1967, influencing my keyboard playing, songwriting styles, and much of our Barnes & Barnes work. And basically, an influence in my whole lifestyle.
All the best,
Robert Haimer
Barnes & Barnes / Mumy's friend....
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For a few days in the summer of 1967, Dak To airport in South Vietnam's highlands was the busiest airport in the world with hundreds of Army helicopters and Air Force transports landing and departing during raging battles. Our newest pilot arrived into this chaos aboard a C-130. As I helped him with his duffle bag, we walked to our tents and he opened his bag and pulled out the Doors album. It became a revelation, maybe a reason to be there. I don't know. Each night after flying combat missions all day and in between fending off attacks, we listened to all the songs on that album. Start to finish on each side and then repeating. The Doors formed a bridge for us from the jungle back to LA and the world.
Regards
Steve Greene
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I was in the third row at the New Haven Arena the infamous night Jim was arrested onstage 5 songs into the Doors' performance. Jim had been accosted backstage by a New Haven cop who found him in the bathroom with a girl and wound up getting maced. Once onstage Jim berated the "little blue men in their little blue suits" repeatedly until they literally escorted him off the stage. The only video of the arrest was shot by my best friend sitting next to me with his 8mm camera and can be found here: . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHmK9ERyBOw&ab_channel=JesusDerasAlvarez. Ray Manzarek's telling of the tale: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPf-OeepYn4&ab_channel=bignz721
And of course, the scene was re-created in Oliver Stone's film "The Doors"
Dick Wingate
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Bob, amazing how I relate to your experiences growing up.
(we are about the same age)
The one and only 8 track tape I ever had was the Doors. The only 8 track tape player I had was in my ski boat.
Great memories of taking my (first) girl out in the boat, after dark to wear out that tape. Anytime I hear the doors now, I think of that girl (and many other times too :- )
My family had a cabin on Mission Lake in Northern MN. I can imagine it must have irritated a lot of neighbors along the lakeshore.
I met my girl first year at U of MN. She had a summer camp counselor job near our cabin. :- )
John Dresser
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When at high school, in my final year, I was told one day to give a short lesson to the chapel which used to sit every Sunday with about 200 boarders.
I decided to read out the opening statement from The Soft Parade. When I got to the line You Can NOT Petition the Lord with Prayer, there was this audible gasp around the attendees.
I was summoned by the headmaster after the service ,and told that I was "gated" till the end of term! "Gated" meant I was not allowed to leave the school grounds!
Richard Griffiths
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Nice piece, Bob. Not a big fan of the Doors but do love the debut. I don't think there's a better first track on a debut album than Break On Through.
Michael Craig
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Many thanks for giving The Crystal Ship it's due! I too felt mystical romance in that song in my teen years - still do. The Doors will always be magic to me.
You know that Ray Manzarek produced X's first 5 albums and played on many. Their cover of The Crystal Ship for the X-Files movie is worth a listen. Gets better as you get into it, with Billy Zoom's guitar solo, into X's trademark John Doe and Exene harmonies - true to the original song's ending.
https://youtu.be/ZdYQ8VHsJLM
When we get back, I'll drop a line.
Jim Mulhern
Detroit
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I was 13 years old in 1966- my favorite band was Them- "Mystic Eyes," "Gloria," "Baby Please Don't Go." They had a matinee at the Whiskey- all ages- this was my first concert. I asked a guy who this cool opening band was. He said "The Doors." Van and Jim. The Morrison Brothers. My rock and roll baptism.
Six months later the first LP was announced by the first billboard on Sunset Strip to advertise a rock band.
Mike Minky
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When I got back to college from holiday break, first week of January
1967, I went to Korvette's looking for albums to buy. I saw The Doors
first LP, liked the cover photo, kinda Stones, and I liked the fact
that it was on Elektra. From Tim Buckley to Butterfield and Love,
Elektra was credible.
At that moment, the cultural shift, lack of inhibition, freedom for
invention, was only known by the few devotees.
Had a smoke, put on side one "Break On Through" to "Light My Fire",
extraordinary. Side two, not as strong but still riveting. Then "The
End" - there had been no warning, nothing about this band in print, or
on radio.
Just over 5 minutes in, over the slinky, sexy music ... "the killer
awoke before dawn" ... where are they going? Then they went as far
as anyone would ever go with 'popular' music.
A crystalized cultural signpost
Paul Zullo
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I used to go see the Doors play at Bito Lido's on Cosmo St in Hollywood around the corner from The Sound Factory where I started.
They were making $15.00 a night and it's also where Ronnie Haran first saw the Doors and got them to Jack Holtzman and where Arthur Lee & love first started playing.
Val Garay
_____________________________________
Thanks Bob,that was great.I remember skateboarding to downtown Stamford to go to a dive bar.They let us kids in to play the jukebox.We played both sides of all the Doors singles.Same thing at a pizza parlor in Springdale.Maybe get a slice,but spend everything on the Jukebox.Thanks,Stay Safe,Ted Keane
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Long time reader, first time commenter. It took your essay on the Doors to nudge me off the dime.
The fact that you labeled it "Crystal Ship" got me right away. It was one of my favorite songs off their album as well. I first played the album in the fall of '67, my sophomore year in college, a buddy introduced me to them. After hearing that song, Whiskey Bar, Light My Fire and, of course, The End. that was it for me, they were and still are a huge influence on my life. Later in early 70's when I was in Thailand flying gunships, we would land, go downtown and there would always be a bar with a Philipino band (they were all very good!) that liked to play Doors music. It didn't really sound like the Doors but they were so enthusiastic that you could still get into it.
And you are right about their other albums - there was something to love on everyone, little secret ones like the spoken Horse Latitudes on 2nd album, 5 to 1 on Waiting for the Sun and I really did like Soft Parade. Oddly, I never met a woman who really liked the Doors - despite the god-like beauty of the early Jim Morrison.
Anyway, thanks for refreshing my memories and recognizing the genius of the Doors.
D Roger Pederson
Minneapolis MN
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Thank you for the spectacular Doors Tribute.
At a number of spots you refer to how the great sound of those records captured your imagination.
But you neglect to mention the genius Recording Engineer/Mixer of all the Doors records: Bruce Botnick.
(Bruce also produced the LA Women album, with Riders on the Storm).
The sound Bruce got on those albums goes a long way to explaining why they are still played on radio today.
While all their most brilliant peers (Beach Boys, Byrds, SF Bands) are relegated to the 60's channels, and Oldies stations.
The Doors records have a sound that is totally contemporary, courtesy of Bruce Botnick.
The Doors first album was recorded in LA in August 1966 by Bruce, age 21.
Nothing else from LA, NY or Nashville sounded that good in '66.
In April of '66 Geoff Emerick (age 20) started work as the Beatles engineer on what would become Revolver.
Glyn Johns (age 24) is recording Between the Buttons with the Stones in '66, and then Satanic.
The Doors recording is a full year before Glyn Johns recorded the magnificent Beggars Banquet in London, with Jimmy Miller producing.
And two years before Glyn recorded the first Led Zep album, where new technology, and new tools were making a dramatic difference.
Where the power of a drummer like John Bonham could actually be captured for the first time.
Which is all to underscore the genius of Bruce Botnick, and what he (and Paul Rothchild) did that late summer of '66 for The Doors.
And continued to do on all their albums.
Paul Rothchild reported that they recorded for one week, and mixed for six weeks!
Reminding us that really transcendent recording, mixing and sound can contribute to an album living forever.
Big thanks,
Hank Neuberger
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Two other factors that weigh into the Doors revival: The American Prayer album by Jim Morrison which came out in November 1978, and the Jerry Hopkins book "No One Here Gets Out Alive" that came out in 1980.
The Morrison album was a dud, except for a blistering live version of Roadhouse Blues with the Soft Parade intro.
Jeff Horowitz
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Many psychedelic experiences watching the sun rise while listening to the Doors! Jim Morrison was the ultimate bad ass rock star!
Harvey Leeds
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Bob, it's funny you should write this because, to this day, I remember that the first music video I ever
saw was "Break on Through".
It was shown on my local weekday after-school "American Bandstand" -style TV show, and it made quite
an impression on this 16 year old, both the music and the video!
Loved reading your memories of The Doors.
Best wishes,
David Hendley
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The Doors - The Crystal Ship / Dick Clark Interview / Light My Fire: https://bit.ly/34CHo1d
Don Huber
_____________________________________
The Doors were so influential on bands like Joy Division and Echo and the Bunnymen and there will always be Americans who look to England for their cultural touchstones, even if they lead back to the states. Cool discussion here: https://www.reddit.com/r/LetsTalkMusic/comments/8qxd1f/the_doors_and_their_influence_on_postpunk_and
Carl P. Lavin
P.S. Also, when you quote "The crystal ship is being filled
A thousand girls, a thousand thrills" without the follow up line of "a million ways to spend your time" it leaves out that 1000 x 1000 = 1,000,000 and all that comes along with the suggestion of that equation.
_____________________________________
Superb piece, Bob! The Doors's music is timeless and continues to "swim in mystery" ("Unhappy Gil") and enchant millions.
Two stories:
Shortly after the late producer Hal Willner brought the 24 year-old Jeff Buckley and I together to collaborate for Hal's Tribute to Tim Buckley at St. Ann's Church in Brooklyn in spring 1'91, Jeff came over to my apartment in the West Village to work up one of his father's songs. We clicked, you could say—and afterwards I invited Jeff to lunch at my local, the White Horse Tavern (where Dylan Thomas famously drank himself to death). Over lunch, as musicians often do when they first get together, we began to sniff each other out regarding our favorite music—and we quickly agreed on a short list of The Doors, Led Zeppelin, and The Smiths. I was looking for a lead singer then for my band Gods and Monsters, and hearing the name of my band immediately sealed the deal with Jeff. Why? Because in the Oliver Stone film "The Doors", Jim's witchy girlfriend
rock writer Patricia Kenneally (played by Kathleen Quinlan) becomes impregnated by Mr. Mojo Risin', who urges abortion, and Patricia / Kathleen, who wants to keep their baby, retorts: "Knowing you, it would either be a God or a Monster." Which nearly caused me to jump out of my seat in the theater seeing the film the first time (I'd already had my group going under that name for several years). Jeff dug that film and quickly recalled that line of dialogue, and said to meL "I love that name!" So he was in.
Some years later I was in Paris working with French star Elli Medeiros, who lived near Pere Lachaise Cemetery. Jim is buried there along with Chopin and Oscar Wilde. I went over there one day there to pay my respects and a swarm of hundreds of young people excitedly whizzed by me at the entrance. Sure enough, they were also in search of Morrison's grave-- so I followed them to the gravesite, which was surrounded by yellow crime scene tape—the night before someone had stolen the bust of Jim Morrison which normally perched over his grave (this was not the first time that had happened). The kicker is, those hundreds of kids crowding Jim's grave were young Polish Catholic believers who had flown in with the then Polish Pope that morning—he was due to deliver a nationwide address in a stadium in Paris that evening. The first item on these kids' agenda though was to visit the grave of the Lizard King himself, Jim Morrison. The power of Jim compels thee!
all the best
Gary Lucas
_____________________________________
In July of 1971 me and a friend were on the back end of a motorcycle trip from DC to Nova Scotia. We took the ferry from Yarmouth to Bangor and after a very long inspection by Customs we rode into town and checked into a hotel in downtown.
My room had a bed with a huge headboard which had a radio embedded in the middle of it, something I didn't notice until the next morning when it turned itself on. I was awoken out of a deep sleep by this ghostly voice somewhere above my head announcing that Jim Morrison had died in Paris, one of the more surreal moments in my life.
As a Vietnam vet I appreciated the mood captured in Apocalypse Now. And yes, The End was the perfect song for that moment. The younger me liked Crystal Ship, but the older me loves LA Woman. (For my money, the TV show China Beach best captured the totality of the Vietnam experience.)
George Laugelli
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Great remembrance. I saw Apocalypse Now at the Cinerama dome too. It was billed as a work in progress and I still have the booklet with the credits they gave out. I had never heard The Doors so loud. I remember "Saigon. Shit. I'm still in Saigon." rattling my innards.
Before COVID I had a 4 night a week piano bar gig at two different restaurants. Dear John's in Culver City and Casa Ado n Marina del Rey. I always hoped you would catch me sometimes. I do many strange thematic medleys. Plus the first side of The Doors.
Hope to meet you someday at The Next Whisky Bar.
Zimmy del Rey
_____________________________________
It's that feeling of wrapping her in your arms with your hands touching her chest and breathing into the soft hair between her neck and ear.
This song is the audio version of Gustav Klimt's "The Kiss" ...
The pallette and canvas is your mind... infinitely far more colors to choose from...
Ray Manzarek always said Jim was a genius ... Thanks for writing about this song...
Keith Miller
_____________________________________
Bob, not only is Crystal Ship also my favorite Doors song, it's in the top 5 of my favorites of ALL songs. Long story short, Ray Manzarek once loaned me his ID, (because I was19 at the time), to come in and see The Doors when they were playing at the London Fog, around late1966. And Morrison loaned his ID to my friend. When we went inside, there were only 3 people in the club, (rainy Tuesday night I believe). Can't remember much about the band except they were playing on a high stage at the rear of the long skinny club, and we gave their IDs back to them when they finished their set..
Several years later, (1972) I was singing in a covers/original band and we did a bunch of Doors tunes, but never did Crystal Ship. We had a great keyboardist with a Farfisa who played just like Manzarek.
In November of 2019 I celebrated the 50th anniversary of my business. I rented a hall in Glendale and invited 100 guests, and my old band from 1972, (4 out of 5 original guys), played a set. We did Light My Fire & 20th Century Fox and, finally......Crystal Ship.
Sterling Howard
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You hit a sentimental note when you wrote about The Doors. Its funny when I hear Howard Stern claims they were overrated... No way.... Maybe it's an East Coast vs. the West Coast thing? The Doors were the quintessential rock band that wrote songs about the dark side of Los Angeles.. Their debut lp was the first record "I" bought with my allowance! It saved me from the rigors of trying to be "cool" and being misunderstood by the world.. No matter what I did I was never goin' to be cool!
The Doors played at my high school and they were awful... none of the songs sounded like the record.. The headline band was Jefferson Airplane and they kicked ass...
I still listen to The Doors on Spotify... and songs like, "Moonlight Drive".. "Summers Almost Gone" segueing into "Wintertime Love" is true artistry... shit I can go on and on... Again, when folks say The Doors were overrated I'm just dumbfounded...Perhaps the greatest L.A. rock band ever!
Jeff Laufer
_____________________________________
Thanks Bob! You're writing about powerful years in our culture that nobody understands.
My wife & I are your age … and we were with our sons and their wives tonight … talking about movies … while our daughter-in-law was playing multiple Doors albums … vinyl … not cds.
We were all talking about how terrible movies have been for many years. My wife & I watched "Harper" last night … the fun 1966 Paul Newman movie … after we'd tried a bunch of recent, unwatchable movies.
The joke between us all is my assertion that the "music died in 1973" … I knew it then.
It really never got past 1971:
LA Woman - the Doors
Who's Next - The Who
Aqualung - Jethro Tull
Led Zeppelin IV - Led Zeppelin
Allman Bros at Fillmore East - Allman Bros
The Yes Album - Yes
Every Good Boy Deserves Favor - Moody Blues
Sticky Fingers - Rolling Stones
Think about it … music crashed and burned in 1973.
And movies … yes "Godfather II" was the best. And, "Clockwork Orange" and "2001".
I couldn't watch the so-called "blockbusters".
Thanks for the flashbacks … we need more understanding of those years … why the artistry died … and how corporate rock and blockbuster movies took over.
Tom Abts
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Good to see some of these deeper cuts getting the attention they deserve. Yep The Doors are renowned for pushing boundaries and for lengthy psychedelic explorations but the sensitive (sappy?) side of The Doors & Jim hardly ever gets mentioned. The Crystal Ship and Love Street also are just 2 great examples of this sensitive side, they are songs that you could play to someone who is only passingly familiar with the music of The Doors and you would probably get some kind of response akin to "I didn't know they were capable to of this"
Chris Xynos
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you are missing the best song on the Apocalypse Now score and that is Samuel Barber's Adagio for Strings
Nathan Mann
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Thanks, Bob! Love it! I've still not forgiven my parents for not taking me to the Phx. show when I was seven years old; they should have known by then what to expect. From hearing that first album, I was way in. I used to wear a People are strange button. Had my first car accident while blasting Alabama Song. There was a girl in my high school named Crystal Shipp, and we thought that was about the coolest name ever.
LA Woman is my favorite, but I do contend that Roadhouse Blues is the greatest rock n roll song ever, the main reason being it captures it all in: I woke up this morning and got myself a beer / The future's uncertain and the end is always near. That's why rock n roll. I did get to see Robbie Krieger a year or two ago and he was great!
Steve Winter
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Loved the write up on The Doors. I was 13 in 1982. I knew "Light My Fire", "Hello, I Love You", and "Touch Me" from my radio listening (HCN in Hartford or PLR in New Haven). I had an Aunt who loved the Doors and after perusing her copy of "No One Here Gets Out Alive", I decided to read it. Man......what a story! Especially the part about maybe he's still alive!!!! Bogus for sure, but my 13 year old brain dug it! I decided to dive in. Got the 1980 Greatest Hits first. It was quite the revelation. And maybe the biggest take away from it, for me (being a drummer), was how great the drummer was! John Densmore is more like a jazz drummer to me than a rock drummer. I just loved what he played on everything. It was only a matter of time before I had all of the studio albums. I could go on and on about how cool it was to discover this music.......and in 1982!
Even though I wasn't around for the first go 'round, I'm glad they eventually showed up on my radar. It's an enjoyable body of work. The studio albums alone have been more than enough for me. I keep finding stuff to dig about it even now as a 51 year old. You have to hand it to the gatekeepers. There seems to have been some kind of Doors release every year for the last 30 years!
Ed Toth
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Great stuff Bob! I was slightly ahead of the Doors renaissance as a freshman in 1979; with thanks to my neighbor, while growing up in Livingston NJ, who was a fan and loved them when he was in college, in your old hood at Fairfield U, where I would eventually attend as well. I remember being told that the Doors are lame and suck inter Alia, but I said wait and see. By sophomore year almost everyone was in to them lol. Speaking of the Crystal Ship and I remember seeing the wonderful cover band ironically called the Crystal Ship at Morristown NJ's rock club The Final Exam, sort of my first concert. My friends dad worked the food stand and got us "in" as we were underage. Met the band after the show and recall the lead singer telling me he went to South Carolina U on a football scholarship, busted his leg up and decided to become a rock n roller!
Years down the road was lucky to meet Ray M when I was at VH1 and we had a wonderful chat about their music, impact and his first band Rick and the Ravens.
In fact regaled him with a little story on how the Doors got me my first job out of college on Wall Street. After all the perfunctory interview questions, my interviewer asked me who my favorite bands were and we connected on the Doors. He asked me "why did u throw the jack of hearts away?" And as I am telling Ray this his eyes light up and he sings "cause it's the only card in the deck that I had left to play." He then told me that made his day.....mine as well. Here I am connecting with the guy who's poster was in my bedroom years ago. Power of rock n roll:).
BTW I always thought when Jim sang "ride the Kings Highway baby" he was referring to our little road in Fairfield/Bridgeport lol.....maybe should have asked Ray that as well!
Happy holidays Bob
Gene Bolan
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I've always understood Jim Morrison through Kurt Cobain, and understood Kurt via Jim.
I started high school in 1990...the year that the Oliver Stone movie was released. The Doors became my gateway drug between radio music and real music. The Doors, via the film, led me to The Velvet Underground, and they've been opening (proverbial) doors for roughly 30 years. When I started hearing about Nirvana, I imagined a similar ethos. The '27 Club' connection was an unfortunate affirmation.
Heather Church
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Born in 1971, the Doors didn't come to my attention until the summer of '87 when Echo and the Bunnymen covered People Are Strange for The Lost Boys. I liked the song enough to look for it after the film and found the Doors.
My friends and I had been digging up our weird uncle's records to hear more pot smoking music, having found Zep and Hendrix. The biography "No One Here Gets Out Alive" was the first rock bio I read. We grew up metal kids, but there was something otherwordly calling us from the older music. We were the kids who would end up crowding into the Dead lots to eat acid and commune with the aging freaks before turning to grunge and harder drugs.
But the Doors had a special place before it began to sound pretentious - mostly thanks to Oliver Stone's movie. Suddenly everyone knew them and I had to walk away. Or maybe I just grew older. I think Jim and the boys still speak to the wild child in the hearts of 17 year olds. I still see the t-shirts on kids. I think that is a wonderful place for them to live forever.
Jeff Kinard
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Just this past week, there was a thread on Facebook about favorite Doors songs. The two most-mentioned were Crystal Ship and The End. My own two favorites are Crystal Ship and one that I'm surprised you didn't even mention: When the Music's Over. That one still hits hard when I hear it. And the story behind the recording of it is mind-blowing. Jim missed the recording session but the band had been playing it so much live that they were able to record the track without him and Jim came in and dubbed his part later. Wow.
- Mark Towns
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I never really GOT the doors until Apocalypse Now.
I don't think I've ever seen any song fit so well in a film.
richard sales
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Born in 1961, I was too young to be a part of the first wave of The Doors. However, there were pockets of fans at Kenyon College in the early 1980s and I got hooked. Then, in 2003 at Boston's Orpheum Theater, I saw Manzarek and Krieger reunited as "An Evening with The Doors of the 21st Century" with Stewart Copeland of The Police on drums and Ian Astbury of The Cult channeling Morrison. Many people hated the idea of this tour but I loved being able to squint and imagine what the late '60s shows must have been like.
David Meerman Scott
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1990 and I'm in my second Freshman year of college. It's a small college in Henniker, NH. I've made friends with the folks at the radio station and start helping out, part time DJ, sorting records and what-not. The radio has a broadcast range of probably 5 miles but it's enough in pre-internet times - everyone listens to this station. In the bins I find "An American Prayer." I have this album at home, I stole it from my cool uncle Tommy. I've listened to it and know it pretty much by heart. I make a joke at some point to my DJ friends about how we should never play that album on the air. They laugh. "How bad could it be?" They have no idea.
Few weeks later and my friends are drinking on a Saturday night and taking requests and playing whatever they feel like, the PD went home for the weekend and I hear them say why don't we play that "American Prayer" album? I shudder, put my shoes on and start running to the basement of the library where the station is located.
We'll get shut down. The FCC will terminate our license. Heads will roll. This will be bad.
The outside door is locked and they can't hear me but I can hear what they are broadcasting through an external speaker by the door.
"Her cunt gripped him like a warm friendly hand." ZZZZZZZZZZZIIIIIIpppppppppppppp The needle goes off the record. There is complete silence. One of them comes on the mic very nervously "ssssorrryy about that folks. We, uh, uh, we, didn't, uh, know..." and then something by either the Trash Can Sinatras or Dee-Lite starts pumping through the radio.
They let me in.
"Why did you play that?"
"We had no idea that was on there."
"I told you not to play that."
"We thought you were joking about not liking the Doors and how you thought they were terrible."
"I'm a fan of The Doors! I know that album!!"
People definitely heard it but not beyond Henniker. It is probably the only time that record received airplay.
We were so small there were no fines, no shut down by the FCC, nothing at all happened.
The waning days of college radio. It was *this* close to pirate radio at times. I loved it and I miss it.
Oh and why can't we get Weird Scenes Inside The Goldmine on cd or streaming sites yet? I really want to hear "You need meat!"
--
Bobbo
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It was 1968, I'm glad you too remember it so well. I was living back at home in Toronto with my Mom and two sisters after a nearly two year stint in LA where I escaped from a Toronto winter in 1966 to follow my heart and my 15 year old sweetheart whose parents had relocated there and wanted her back. But we had eloped to Ensenada Mexico and after a kerfuffle with her parents we were back home in Hog Town wondering what the hell to do about the dearth of the weekly doses of rock and roll we had become addicted to on the Sunset Strip while living first at her parents apartment and then my Hollywood pad after I got a job selling photocopy paper and started making gobs of money.
I mustered up some capital from a rich Uncle of a former school chum, got the CNE Coliseum from another friend's dad who was the facility manager, and using a helpful information operator, (remember them) started phoning booking agents in New York and after I think only one other, Associated Booking, got Agency for The Performing Arts and asked for the agent for The Doors. Richard Loren came on the phone and for $10,000 US against 50% of the gross with a $5,000 deposit, I was sitting a week later with a contract for The Doors to play their first Candian gig April 20, 1968. I could and should write a book about the ensuing year or two but for this little story I will keep it short. Two limos were called for in the rider and Richard had instructed me to bring 6 beers for Jim who would ride in one alone, the band and manager would use the other. After the band departed I found myself at the curb with Morrison and we both got in and headed into the city. The six beers sat on the floor between us and Jim opened one (Heineken, I had been told no Budweiser, which were not even for sale in Canada at that time). He finished it and opened another and with a slight shift of the shoulder indicated for me to have one. I complied and began to sip as Jim enjoyed the others as he stared out the window at this new city. The limo pulled up to the curb in front of the hotel , the driver rushed out and around to open the door for Jim who stepped out and while with one foot still in the car turned to me and said, "Hey man, thanks for not talking." I was too terrified to say a word and we had ridden into Toronto in silence. Loren told me the next day after they of course sold out, " You did good man, Jim told me he likes the promoter." The next year after what seemed a lifetime of promoting concerts and festivals, including being on stage most of Saturday and Sunday at Woodstock, I brought The Doors back despite furious opposition from my partners, to headline The Toronto Rock and Roll Revival in September '69. This of course was after Miami and Jim's felony charges, but it was The Doors and as a promoter the music meant more than any police-state misunderstanding of performance art. It took a surprise appearance by John Lennon and The Plastic Ono band to sell out the 20,000 seat stadium but after a brief discussion about who would/should close the show between Jim and John it was agreed as scheduled The Doors would close after John and Eric, Yoko, Klaus and Alan played. In one of the most electrifying performances of his career, Morrison, although no longer looking like the Lizard King of a year and a half before, gave testament to why your piece Crystal Ship has such meaning. And included in their spellbinding set, Robby Kreiger magically wove the melody to Eleanor Rigby into the guitar solo of Light My Fire. ( I have the bootleg). As was his wont, Jim most often began The End with a brief or longer recitation of his current observation of life and that night would be no different. I share them with you now.
"I can remember when Rock n' Roll first came on the scene. And for me it was, uh, a very liberating experience because it burst open whole new strange catacombs of wisdom that I couldn't remember about and didn't know anything about and I couldn't see any equivalent for in my surroundings. And that's why for me this evening it has been such a great honor to perform on this stage with so many illustrious musical geniuses."
Of course he was referring to Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Jerry Lee Lewis, Bo Diddley, Gene Vincent, and John Lennon, Eric Clapton, Klaus Voorman and Alan White.
Long live Rock and Roll.
A night for the ages. Yeah, I think I'll write that book.
John Brower
Toronto
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Well, you're either on the ship or off the ship... as The Doors would(n't) say.
John Hughes
Rich Linnell and I promoted our first concert of the doors at Long Beach State in the gym. In order to get a venue on campus we had to affiliate with an on-campus organization. We chose the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee and paid them 5% of the gross. We held the record for paying the doors the most money for at least the next six months when their career was exploding.
Three weeks later they offered me the job of being the manager and I said I could only do it if I could find a way to beat the draft. They agreed to pay all the expenses so I went to the woman we worked with at SNCC, and she referred me to a William Smith draft lawyer specialist.
Long story short, it worked. But I really thought I was a conscientious objector and spent months agonizing over whether I would return to Canada in order to not have to go kill people.
Cut to 11 years later when George Steele and I go to San Francisco to see a rough cut of "Apocalypse now" at Francis Ford Coppola's house in San Francisco. I was completely destroyed by the film and how it resonated with the choices I've made in my life.I could barely walk out of the screening room. Luckily they provided a barrel tasting of Mr. Coppola's new venture in making wine. It was a turning point for me, and I have to agree with you it was a turning point for the doors.
Bill Siddons
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Loved your latest, about THE DOORS & MORRISON. I too, am a first generation DOORS fanatic. (Bill Mumy sent me your article. I'm his partner "Artie Barnes", from our duo Barnes & Barnes).
Mumy & I saw The Doors live 3 times, once in the front row of the L.A. Aquarius Theatre show #1, 1969. Ahhh, sweet youth. Jim looked into our eyes. That's burned into my soul forever... Like I just told Mumy, I knew the Doors were special and eternal then, in 1967, and it has stayed true for the last 53 years. And now as I'm getting "old", and when I'm gone, like you say, the Doors will still be entrancing generations to come. Jim was a "God".... Mumy talked to him in an elevator in 1970, as I'm sure he's told you. I'm STILL jealous! Thru my being in the music biz, I became friendly with Manzarek. He was always nice to me, even as a 19 year old pimple faced kid, when I would run into him around town. Then we got friendly, and it was a true treat to have known him better. I went to his house, he was supposed to come over to my house, 'cuz I might have been able to get him a record deal in 1991, but I chickened out in making that happen..... That's something I regret not pushing harder to happen... My wife was a Sr. VP at a few major labels back in the day..
Anyway, just thought I'd say hi, well done on your story. The Doors have been with me daily since 1967, influencing my keyboard playing, songwriting styles, and much of our Barnes & Barnes work. And basically, an influence in my whole lifestyle.
All the best,
Robert Haimer
Barnes & Barnes / Mumy's friend....
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For a few days in the summer of 1967, Dak To airport in South Vietnam's highlands was the busiest airport in the world with hundreds of Army helicopters and Air Force transports landing and departing during raging battles. Our newest pilot arrived into this chaos aboard a C-130. As I helped him with his duffle bag, we walked to our tents and he opened his bag and pulled out the Doors album. It became a revelation, maybe a reason to be there. I don't know. Each night after flying combat missions all day and in between fending off attacks, we listened to all the songs on that album. Start to finish on each side and then repeating. The Doors formed a bridge for us from the jungle back to LA and the world.
Regards
Steve Greene
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I was in the third row at the New Haven Arena the infamous night Jim was arrested onstage 5 songs into the Doors' performance. Jim had been accosted backstage by a New Haven cop who found him in the bathroom with a girl and wound up getting maced. Once onstage Jim berated the "little blue men in their little blue suits" repeatedly until they literally escorted him off the stage. The only video of the arrest was shot by my best friend sitting next to me with his 8mm camera and can be found here: . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHmK9ERyBOw&ab_channel=JesusDerasAlvarez. Ray Manzarek's telling of the tale: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPf-OeepYn4&ab_channel=bignz721
And of course, the scene was re-created in Oliver Stone's film "The Doors"
Dick Wingate
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Bob, amazing how I relate to your experiences growing up.
(we are about the same age)
The one and only 8 track tape I ever had was the Doors. The only 8 track tape player I had was in my ski boat.
Great memories of taking my (first) girl out in the boat, after dark to wear out that tape. Anytime I hear the doors now, I think of that girl (and many other times too :- )
My family had a cabin on Mission Lake in Northern MN. I can imagine it must have irritated a lot of neighbors along the lakeshore.
I met my girl first year at U of MN. She had a summer camp counselor job near our cabin. :- )
John Dresser
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When at high school, in my final year, I was told one day to give a short lesson to the chapel which used to sit every Sunday with about 200 boarders.
I decided to read out the opening statement from The Soft Parade. When I got to the line You Can NOT Petition the Lord with Prayer, there was this audible gasp around the attendees.
I was summoned by the headmaster after the service ,and told that I was "gated" till the end of term! "Gated" meant I was not allowed to leave the school grounds!
Richard Griffiths
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Nice piece, Bob. Not a big fan of the Doors but do love the debut. I don't think there's a better first track on a debut album than Break On Through.
Michael Craig
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Many thanks for giving The Crystal Ship it's due! I too felt mystical romance in that song in my teen years - still do. The Doors will always be magic to me.
You know that Ray Manzarek produced X's first 5 albums and played on many. Their cover of The Crystal Ship for the X-Files movie is worth a listen. Gets better as you get into it, with Billy Zoom's guitar solo, into X's trademark John Doe and Exene harmonies - true to the original song's ending.
https://youtu.be/ZdYQ8VHsJLM
When we get back, I'll drop a line.
Jim Mulhern
Detroit
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I was 13 years old in 1966- my favorite band was Them- "Mystic Eyes," "Gloria," "Baby Please Don't Go." They had a matinee at the Whiskey- all ages- this was my first concert. I asked a guy who this cool opening band was. He said "The Doors." Van and Jim. The Morrison Brothers. My rock and roll baptism.
Six months later the first LP was announced by the first billboard on Sunset Strip to advertise a rock band.
Mike Minky
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When I got back to college from holiday break, first week of January
1967, I went to Korvette's looking for albums to buy. I saw The Doors
first LP, liked the cover photo, kinda Stones, and I liked the fact
that it was on Elektra. From Tim Buckley to Butterfield and Love,
Elektra was credible.
At that moment, the cultural shift, lack of inhibition, freedom for
invention, was only known by the few devotees.
Had a smoke, put on side one "Break On Through" to "Light My Fire",
extraordinary. Side two, not as strong but still riveting. Then "The
End" - there had been no warning, nothing about this band in print, or
on radio.
Just over 5 minutes in, over the slinky, sexy music ... "the killer
awoke before dawn" ... where are they going? Then they went as far
as anyone would ever go with 'popular' music.
A crystalized cultural signpost
Paul Zullo
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I used to go see the Doors play at Bito Lido's on Cosmo St in Hollywood around the corner from The Sound Factory where I started.
They were making $15.00 a night and it's also where Ronnie Haran first saw the Doors and got them to Jack Holtzman and where Arthur Lee & love first started playing.
Val Garay
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Thanks Bob,that was great.I remember skateboarding to downtown Stamford to go to a dive bar.They let us kids in to play the jukebox.We played both sides of all the Doors singles.Same thing at a pizza parlor in Springdale.Maybe get a slice,but spend everything on the Jukebox.Thanks,Stay Safe,Ted Keane
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Long time reader, first time commenter. It took your essay on the Doors to nudge me off the dime.
The fact that you labeled it "Crystal Ship" got me right away. It was one of my favorite songs off their album as well. I first played the album in the fall of '67, my sophomore year in college, a buddy introduced me to them. After hearing that song, Whiskey Bar, Light My Fire and, of course, The End. that was it for me, they were and still are a huge influence on my life. Later in early 70's when I was in Thailand flying gunships, we would land, go downtown and there would always be a bar with a Philipino band (they were all very good!) that liked to play Doors music. It didn't really sound like the Doors but they were so enthusiastic that you could still get into it.
And you are right about their other albums - there was something to love on everyone, little secret ones like the spoken Horse Latitudes on 2nd album, 5 to 1 on Waiting for the Sun and I really did like Soft Parade. Oddly, I never met a woman who really liked the Doors - despite the god-like beauty of the early Jim Morrison.
Anyway, thanks for refreshing my memories and recognizing the genius of the Doors.
D Roger Pederson
Minneapolis MN
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Thank you for the spectacular Doors Tribute.
At a number of spots you refer to how the great sound of those records captured your imagination.
But you neglect to mention the genius Recording Engineer/Mixer of all the Doors records: Bruce Botnick.
(Bruce also produced the LA Women album, with Riders on the Storm).
The sound Bruce got on those albums goes a long way to explaining why they are still played on radio today.
While all their most brilliant peers (Beach Boys, Byrds, SF Bands) are relegated to the 60's channels, and Oldies stations.
The Doors records have a sound that is totally contemporary, courtesy of Bruce Botnick.
The Doors first album was recorded in LA in August 1966 by Bruce, age 21.
Nothing else from LA, NY or Nashville sounded that good in '66.
In April of '66 Geoff Emerick (age 20) started work as the Beatles engineer on what would become Revolver.
Glyn Johns (age 24) is recording Between the Buttons with the Stones in '66, and then Satanic.
The Doors recording is a full year before Glyn Johns recorded the magnificent Beggars Banquet in London, with Jimmy Miller producing.
And two years before Glyn recorded the first Led Zep album, where new technology, and new tools were making a dramatic difference.
Where the power of a drummer like John Bonham could actually be captured for the first time.
Which is all to underscore the genius of Bruce Botnick, and what he (and Paul Rothchild) did that late summer of '66 for The Doors.
And continued to do on all their albums.
Paul Rothchild reported that they recorded for one week, and mixed for six weeks!
Reminding us that really transcendent recording, mixing and sound can contribute to an album living forever.
Big thanks,
Hank Neuberger
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Two other factors that weigh into the Doors revival: The American Prayer album by Jim Morrison which came out in November 1978, and the Jerry Hopkins book "No One Here Gets Out Alive" that came out in 1980.
The Morrison album was a dud, except for a blistering live version of Roadhouse Blues with the Soft Parade intro.
Jeff Horowitz
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Many psychedelic experiences watching the sun rise while listening to the Doors! Jim Morrison was the ultimate bad ass rock star!
Harvey Leeds
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Bob, it's funny you should write this because, to this day, I remember that the first music video I ever
saw was "Break on Through".
It was shown on my local weekday after-school "American Bandstand" -style TV show, and it made quite
an impression on this 16 year old, both the music and the video!
Loved reading your memories of The Doors.
Best wishes,
David Hendley
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The Doors - The Crystal Ship / Dick Clark Interview / Light My Fire: https://bit.ly/34CHo1d
Don Huber
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The Doors were so influential on bands like Joy Division and Echo and the Bunnymen and there will always be Americans who look to England for their cultural touchstones, even if they lead back to the states. Cool discussion here: https://www.reddit.com/r/LetsTalkMusic/comments/8qxd1f/the_doors_and_their_influence_on_postpunk_and
Carl P. Lavin
P.S. Also, when you quote "The crystal ship is being filled
A thousand girls, a thousand thrills" without the follow up line of "a million ways to spend your time" it leaves out that 1000 x 1000 = 1,000,000 and all that comes along with the suggestion of that equation.
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Superb piece, Bob! The Doors's music is timeless and continues to "swim in mystery" ("Unhappy Gil") and enchant millions.
Two stories:
Shortly after the late producer Hal Willner brought the 24 year-old Jeff Buckley and I together to collaborate for Hal's Tribute to Tim Buckley at St. Ann's Church in Brooklyn in spring 1'91, Jeff came over to my apartment in the West Village to work up one of his father's songs. We clicked, you could say—and afterwards I invited Jeff to lunch at my local, the White Horse Tavern (where Dylan Thomas famously drank himself to death). Over lunch, as musicians often do when they first get together, we began to sniff each other out regarding our favorite music—and we quickly agreed on a short list of The Doors, Led Zeppelin, and The Smiths. I was looking for a lead singer then for my band Gods and Monsters, and hearing the name of my band immediately sealed the deal with Jeff. Why? Because in the Oliver Stone film "The Doors", Jim's witchy girlfriend
rock writer Patricia Kenneally (played by Kathleen Quinlan) becomes impregnated by Mr. Mojo Risin', who urges abortion, and Patricia / Kathleen, who wants to keep their baby, retorts: "Knowing you, it would either be a God or a Monster." Which nearly caused me to jump out of my seat in the theater seeing the film the first time (I'd already had my group going under that name for several years). Jeff dug that film and quickly recalled that line of dialogue, and said to meL "I love that name!" So he was in.
Some years later I was in Paris working with French star Elli Medeiros, who lived near Pere Lachaise Cemetery. Jim is buried there along with Chopin and Oscar Wilde. I went over there one day there to pay my respects and a swarm of hundreds of young people excitedly whizzed by me at the entrance. Sure enough, they were also in search of Morrison's grave-- so I followed them to the gravesite, which was surrounded by yellow crime scene tape—the night before someone had stolen the bust of Jim Morrison which normally perched over his grave (this was not the first time that had happened). The kicker is, those hundreds of kids crowding Jim's grave were young Polish Catholic believers who had flown in with the then Polish Pope that morning—he was due to deliver a nationwide address in a stadium in Paris that evening. The first item on these kids' agenda though was to visit the grave of the Lizard King himself, Jim Morrison. The power of Jim compels thee!
all the best
Gary Lucas
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In July of 1971 me and a friend were on the back end of a motorcycle trip from DC to Nova Scotia. We took the ferry from Yarmouth to Bangor and after a very long inspection by Customs we rode into town and checked into a hotel in downtown.
My room had a bed with a huge headboard which had a radio embedded in the middle of it, something I didn't notice until the next morning when it turned itself on. I was awoken out of a deep sleep by this ghostly voice somewhere above my head announcing that Jim Morrison had died in Paris, one of the more surreal moments in my life.
As a Vietnam vet I appreciated the mood captured in Apocalypse Now. And yes, The End was the perfect song for that moment. The younger me liked Crystal Ship, but the older me loves LA Woman. (For my money, the TV show China Beach best captured the totality of the Vietnam experience.)
George Laugelli
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Great remembrance. I saw Apocalypse Now at the Cinerama dome too. It was billed as a work in progress and I still have the booklet with the credits they gave out. I had never heard The Doors so loud. I remember "Saigon. Shit. I'm still in Saigon." rattling my innards.
Before COVID I had a 4 night a week piano bar gig at two different restaurants. Dear John's in Culver City and Casa Ado n Marina del Rey. I always hoped you would catch me sometimes. I do many strange thematic medleys. Plus the first side of The Doors.
Hope to meet you someday at The Next Whisky Bar.
Zimmy del Rey
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It's that feeling of wrapping her in your arms with your hands touching her chest and breathing into the soft hair between her neck and ear.
This song is the audio version of Gustav Klimt's "The Kiss" ...
The pallette and canvas is your mind... infinitely far more colors to choose from...
Ray Manzarek always said Jim was a genius ... Thanks for writing about this song...
Keith Miller
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Bob, not only is Crystal Ship also my favorite Doors song, it's in the top 5 of my favorites of ALL songs. Long story short, Ray Manzarek once loaned me his ID, (because I was19 at the time), to come in and see The Doors when they were playing at the London Fog, around late1966. And Morrison loaned his ID to my friend. When we went inside, there were only 3 people in the club, (rainy Tuesday night I believe). Can't remember much about the band except they were playing on a high stage at the rear of the long skinny club, and we gave their IDs back to them when they finished their set..
Several years later, (1972) I was singing in a covers/original band and we did a bunch of Doors tunes, but never did Crystal Ship. We had a great keyboardist with a Farfisa who played just like Manzarek.
In November of 2019 I celebrated the 50th anniversary of my business. I rented a hall in Glendale and invited 100 guests, and my old band from 1972, (4 out of 5 original guys), played a set. We did Light My Fire & 20th Century Fox and, finally......Crystal Ship.
Sterling Howard
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You hit a sentimental note when you wrote about The Doors. Its funny when I hear Howard Stern claims they were overrated... No way.... Maybe it's an East Coast vs. the West Coast thing? The Doors were the quintessential rock band that wrote songs about the dark side of Los Angeles.. Their debut lp was the first record "I" bought with my allowance! It saved me from the rigors of trying to be "cool" and being misunderstood by the world.. No matter what I did I was never goin' to be cool!
The Doors played at my high school and they were awful... none of the songs sounded like the record.. The headline band was Jefferson Airplane and they kicked ass...
I still listen to The Doors on Spotify... and songs like, "Moonlight Drive".. "Summers Almost Gone" segueing into "Wintertime Love" is true artistry... shit I can go on and on... Again, when folks say The Doors were overrated I'm just dumbfounded...Perhaps the greatest L.A. rock band ever!
Jeff Laufer
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Thanks Bob! You're writing about powerful years in our culture that nobody understands.
My wife & I are your age … and we were with our sons and their wives tonight … talking about movies … while our daughter-in-law was playing multiple Doors albums … vinyl … not cds.
We were all talking about how terrible movies have been for many years. My wife & I watched "Harper" last night … the fun 1966 Paul Newman movie … after we'd tried a bunch of recent, unwatchable movies.
The joke between us all is my assertion that the "music died in 1973" … I knew it then.
It really never got past 1971:
LA Woman - the Doors
Who's Next - The Who
Aqualung - Jethro Tull
Led Zeppelin IV - Led Zeppelin
Allman Bros at Fillmore East - Allman Bros
The Yes Album - Yes
Every Good Boy Deserves Favor - Moody Blues
Sticky Fingers - Rolling Stones
Think about it … music crashed and burned in 1973.
And movies … yes "Godfather II" was the best. And, "Clockwork Orange" and "2001".
I couldn't watch the so-called "blockbusters".
Thanks for the flashbacks … we need more understanding of those years … why the artistry died … and how corporate rock and blockbuster movies took over.
Tom Abts
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Good to see some of these deeper cuts getting the attention they deserve. Yep The Doors are renowned for pushing boundaries and for lengthy psychedelic explorations but the sensitive (sappy?) side of The Doors & Jim hardly ever gets mentioned. The Crystal Ship and Love Street also are just 2 great examples of this sensitive side, they are songs that you could play to someone who is only passingly familiar with the music of The Doors and you would probably get some kind of response akin to "I didn't know they were capable to of this"
Chris Xynos
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you are missing the best song on the Apocalypse Now score and that is Samuel Barber's Adagio for Strings
Nathan Mann
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Thanks, Bob! Love it! I've still not forgiven my parents for not taking me to the Phx. show when I was seven years old; they should have known by then what to expect. From hearing that first album, I was way in. I used to wear a People are strange button. Had my first car accident while blasting Alabama Song. There was a girl in my high school named Crystal Shipp, and we thought that was about the coolest name ever.
LA Woman is my favorite, but I do contend that Roadhouse Blues is the greatest rock n roll song ever, the main reason being it captures it all in: I woke up this morning and got myself a beer / The future's uncertain and the end is always near. That's why rock n roll. I did get to see Robbie Krieger a year or two ago and he was great!
Steve Winter
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Loved the write up on The Doors. I was 13 in 1982. I knew "Light My Fire", "Hello, I Love You", and "Touch Me" from my radio listening (HCN in Hartford or PLR in New Haven). I had an Aunt who loved the Doors and after perusing her copy of "No One Here Gets Out Alive", I decided to read it. Man......what a story! Especially the part about maybe he's still alive!!!! Bogus for sure, but my 13 year old brain dug it! I decided to dive in. Got the 1980 Greatest Hits first. It was quite the revelation. And maybe the biggest take away from it, for me (being a drummer), was how great the drummer was! John Densmore is more like a jazz drummer to me than a rock drummer. I just loved what he played on everything. It was only a matter of time before I had all of the studio albums. I could go on and on about how cool it was to discover this music.......and in 1982!
Even though I wasn't around for the first go 'round, I'm glad they eventually showed up on my radar. It's an enjoyable body of work. The studio albums alone have been more than enough for me. I keep finding stuff to dig about it even now as a 51 year old. You have to hand it to the gatekeepers. There seems to have been some kind of Doors release every year for the last 30 years!
Ed Toth
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Great stuff Bob! I was slightly ahead of the Doors renaissance as a freshman in 1979; with thanks to my neighbor, while growing up in Livingston NJ, who was a fan and loved them when he was in college, in your old hood at Fairfield U, where I would eventually attend as well. I remember being told that the Doors are lame and suck inter Alia, but I said wait and see. By sophomore year almost everyone was in to them lol. Speaking of the Crystal Ship and I remember seeing the wonderful cover band ironically called the Crystal Ship at Morristown NJ's rock club The Final Exam, sort of my first concert. My friends dad worked the food stand and got us "in" as we were underage. Met the band after the show and recall the lead singer telling me he went to South Carolina U on a football scholarship, busted his leg up and decided to become a rock n roller!
Years down the road was lucky to meet Ray M when I was at VH1 and we had a wonderful chat about their music, impact and his first band Rick and the Ravens.
In fact regaled him with a little story on how the Doors got me my first job out of college on Wall Street. After all the perfunctory interview questions, my interviewer asked me who my favorite bands were and we connected on the Doors. He asked me "why did u throw the jack of hearts away?" And as I am telling Ray this his eyes light up and he sings "cause it's the only card in the deck that I had left to play." He then told me that made his day.....mine as well. Here I am connecting with the guy who's poster was in my bedroom years ago. Power of rock n roll:).
BTW I always thought when Jim sang "ride the Kings Highway baby" he was referring to our little road in Fairfield/Bridgeport lol.....maybe should have asked Ray that as well!
Happy holidays Bob
Gene Bolan
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I've always understood Jim Morrison through Kurt Cobain, and understood Kurt via Jim.
I started high school in 1990...the year that the Oliver Stone movie was released. The Doors became my gateway drug between radio music and real music. The Doors, via the film, led me to The Velvet Underground, and they've been opening (proverbial) doors for roughly 30 years. When I started hearing about Nirvana, I imagined a similar ethos. The '27 Club' connection was an unfortunate affirmation.
Heather Church
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Born in 1971, the Doors didn't come to my attention until the summer of '87 when Echo and the Bunnymen covered People Are Strange for The Lost Boys. I liked the song enough to look for it after the film and found the Doors.
My friends and I had been digging up our weird uncle's records to hear more pot smoking music, having found Zep and Hendrix. The biography "No One Here Gets Out Alive" was the first rock bio I read. We grew up metal kids, but there was something otherwordly calling us from the older music. We were the kids who would end up crowding into the Dead lots to eat acid and commune with the aging freaks before turning to grunge and harder drugs.
But the Doors had a special place before it began to sound pretentious - mostly thanks to Oliver Stone's movie. Suddenly everyone knew them and I had to walk away. Or maybe I just grew older. I think Jim and the boys still speak to the wild child in the hearts of 17 year olds. I still see the t-shirts on kids. I think that is a wonderful place for them to live forever.
Jeff Kinard
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Just this past week, there was a thread on Facebook about favorite Doors songs. The two most-mentioned were Crystal Ship and The End. My own two favorites are Crystal Ship and one that I'm surprised you didn't even mention: When the Music's Over. That one still hits hard when I hear it. And the story behind the recording of it is mind-blowing. Jim missed the recording session but the band had been playing it so much live that they were able to record the track without him and Jim came in and dubbed his part later. Wow.
- Mark Towns
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I never really GOT the doors until Apocalypse Now.
I don't think I've ever seen any song fit so well in a film.
richard sales
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Born in 1961, I was too young to be a part of the first wave of The Doors. However, there were pockets of fans at Kenyon College in the early 1980s and I got hooked. Then, in 2003 at Boston's Orpheum Theater, I saw Manzarek and Krieger reunited as "An Evening with The Doors of the 21st Century" with Stewart Copeland of The Police on drums and Ian Astbury of The Cult channeling Morrison. Many people hated the idea of this tour but I loved being able to squint and imagine what the late '60s shows must have been like.
David Meerman Scott
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1990 and I'm in my second Freshman year of college. It's a small college in Henniker, NH. I've made friends with the folks at the radio station and start helping out, part time DJ, sorting records and what-not. The radio has a broadcast range of probably 5 miles but it's enough in pre-internet times - everyone listens to this station. In the bins I find "An American Prayer." I have this album at home, I stole it from my cool uncle Tommy. I've listened to it and know it pretty much by heart. I make a joke at some point to my DJ friends about how we should never play that album on the air. They laugh. "How bad could it be?" They have no idea.
Few weeks later and my friends are drinking on a Saturday night and taking requests and playing whatever they feel like, the PD went home for the weekend and I hear them say why don't we play that "American Prayer" album? I shudder, put my shoes on and start running to the basement of the library where the station is located.
We'll get shut down. The FCC will terminate our license. Heads will roll. This will be bad.
The outside door is locked and they can't hear me but I can hear what they are broadcasting through an external speaker by the door.
"Her cunt gripped him like a warm friendly hand." ZZZZZZZZZZZIIIIIIpppppppppppppp The needle goes off the record. There is complete silence. One of them comes on the mic very nervously "ssssorrryy about that folks. We, uh, uh, we, didn't, uh, know..." and then something by either the Trash Can Sinatras or Dee-Lite starts pumping through the radio.
They let me in.
"Why did you play that?"
"We had no idea that was on there."
"I told you not to play that."
"We thought you were joking about not liking the Doors and how you thought they were terrible."
"I'm a fan of The Doors! I know that album!!"
People definitely heard it but not beyond Henniker. It is probably the only time that record received airplay.
We were so small there were no fines, no shut down by the FCC, nothing at all happened.
The waning days of college radio. It was *this* close to pirate radio at times. I loved it and I miss it.
Oh and why can't we get Weird Scenes Inside The Goldmine on cd or streaming sites yet? I really want to hear "You need meat!"
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Bobbo
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It was 1968, I'm glad you too remember it so well. I was living back at home in Toronto with my Mom and two sisters after a nearly two year stint in LA where I escaped from a Toronto winter in 1966 to follow my heart and my 15 year old sweetheart whose parents had relocated there and wanted her back. But we had eloped to Ensenada Mexico and after a kerfuffle with her parents we were back home in Hog Town wondering what the hell to do about the dearth of the weekly doses of rock and roll we had become addicted to on the Sunset Strip while living first at her parents apartment and then my Hollywood pad after I got a job selling photocopy paper and started making gobs of money.
I mustered up some capital from a rich Uncle of a former school chum, got the CNE Coliseum from another friend's dad who was the facility manager, and using a helpful information operator, (remember them) started phoning booking agents in New York and after I think only one other, Associated Booking, got Agency for The Performing Arts and asked for the agent for The Doors. Richard Loren came on the phone and for $10,000 US against 50% of the gross with a $5,000 deposit, I was sitting a week later with a contract for The Doors to play their first Candian gig April 20, 1968. I could and should write a book about the ensuing year or two but for this little story I will keep it short. Two limos were called for in the rider and Richard had instructed me to bring 6 beers for Jim who would ride in one alone, the band and manager would use the other. After the band departed I found myself at the curb with Morrison and we both got in and headed into the city. The six beers sat on the floor between us and Jim opened one (Heineken, I had been told no Budweiser, which were not even for sale in Canada at that time). He finished it and opened another and with a slight shift of the shoulder indicated for me to have one. I complied and began to sip as Jim enjoyed the others as he stared out the window at this new city. The limo pulled up to the curb in front of the hotel , the driver rushed out and around to open the door for Jim who stepped out and while with one foot still in the car turned to me and said, "Hey man, thanks for not talking." I was too terrified to say a word and we had ridden into Toronto in silence. Loren told me the next day after they of course sold out, " You did good man, Jim told me he likes the promoter." The next year after what seemed a lifetime of promoting concerts and festivals, including being on stage most of Saturday and Sunday at Woodstock, I brought The Doors back despite furious opposition from my partners, to headline The Toronto Rock and Roll Revival in September '69. This of course was after Miami and Jim's felony charges, but it was The Doors and as a promoter the music meant more than any police-state misunderstanding of performance art. It took a surprise appearance by John Lennon and The Plastic Ono band to sell out the 20,000 seat stadium but after a brief discussion about who would/should close the show between Jim and John it was agreed as scheduled The Doors would close after John and Eric, Yoko, Klaus and Alan played. In one of the most electrifying performances of his career, Morrison, although no longer looking like the Lizard King of a year and a half before, gave testament to why your piece Crystal Ship has such meaning. And included in their spellbinding set, Robby Kreiger magically wove the melody to Eleanor Rigby into the guitar solo of Light My Fire. ( I have the bootleg). As was his wont, Jim most often began The End with a brief or longer recitation of his current observation of life and that night would be no different. I share them with you now.
"I can remember when Rock n' Roll first came on the scene. And for me it was, uh, a very liberating experience because it burst open whole new strange catacombs of wisdom that I couldn't remember about and didn't know anything about and I couldn't see any equivalent for in my surroundings. And that's why for me this evening it has been such a great honor to perform on this stage with so many illustrious musical geniuses."
Of course he was referring to Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Jerry Lee Lewis, Bo Diddley, Gene Vincent, and John Lennon, Eric Clapton, Klaus Voorman and Alan White.
Long live Rock and Roll.
A night for the ages. Yeah, I think I'll write that book.
John Brower
Toronto
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Well, you're either on the ship or off the ship... as The Doors would(n't) say.
John Hughes
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