Hip hop streaming is so strong right now not just for major hip hop acts but because it's the best way to discover new acts. We used to hear more stories about program directors that took a chance on a new artist and led the way for the country to follow once it researched. Now we see stories about guys like Carl Cherry at apple who took a chance on a new artist named "6lack" by play listing one of his songs, a week later and 1 million+ plays Carl put in another song and sure enough 2+million streams. Now he's signed to Interscope.(Not saying I agree with that move). Acts like 6lack, 21 Savage etc.. all millions of streams and some of these acts with little or no radio. It won't stop anytime soon.
Gary Marella
President
Mosley Music Group
___________________________________
I really didn't want to open this post, but I did and I'm now wishing I had listened to my gut because it had "Dad Jeans" written all over it. Seriously though, don't be so surprised that rap's killing it on streaming -- where have you and the rest of "the (white Jewish) music industry" been while the multi-multi million dollar hip hop scene has been pushing DIY merch and selling out venues across the country for decades? It's a highly lucrative underground market thriving largely without major label help because selling out totally kills street cred. A good producer, catchy (unlicensed) samples, and hometown hood support used to be what makes or breaks a hip hop artist. Nowadays, it's social media followers and rap blogs that dictate fame, the latter being the best source of new music drops reminiscent of what radio used to provide. It's only a matter of time before one of those singing competition shows comes out with a rap version of The Black Voice, if there isn't already one on BET...
Sarah El Ebiary, Esq.
NW Entertainment Law
___________________________________
Sounds great. If only it had melody and harmony, and instrumentation that wasn't on a loop.
Berton Averre
___________________________________
Are you taking bets that kanye won't perform? We can even make it a parlay. He'll perform and play "power" :)
Scott Vener
___________________________________
there are numerous reasons why hip hop has remained
on top, but there's one obvious one..MTV!
once MTV hit the airwaves, it became the trend-icator..
new wave; Michael Jackson's 'Thriller", the re birth of
rock bands (LoverBoy, Bon Jovi, etc), Madonna and her clones,
hair metal bands & Guns N Roses, Grunge, the re birth
of bubble gum (Spice Girls, Backstreet, N Sync,, Hanson,
Brtitney, etc) and then hip hop all reached overdrive proportions,
MTV and it's coast to coast captive audience made it all happen..
and then music was gone from MTV, replaced by reality shows,
which then became a national trend of it's own..
Hip Hop was the last coast to coast music trend generated by
MTV, and then as music was gone, nothing was ever presented
as 'the next thing' to take it's place.. so it just stuck around..
Jimi LaLumia
___________________________________
Saying Donald trump is hop-hop at first appears to demonstrate a complete lack of understanding of what hip hop is and isn't; yet several of your explanations are spot on. Ironically those explanations themselves indicate that trump isn't hip hop at all.
Binta Niambi Brown
___________________________________
A lot of truth here. A necessary post to spell it out, especially given what I assume are your mailing list's demographics. That said, many hardcore hip-hop fans would argue that most of the gravitas you spell out was more accurate years ago and that the hip-hop of today is more like rock n roll in the 80s - soft and commercial.
The hard guys are now old enough to be inducted into the rock n roll hall of fame.
Happy holidays!
Alex Kruglov
___________________________________
Bravo... finally.. you understand more than most. Detroit, Oakland, Atlanta, Compton, Houston, Baltimore, Philly... New York, Newark! Stand up... we salute you for at least having a clue..
#wakeupeverybody.
In America, there's enough for everybody. Hip Hop is a community that shares... and feeds it's fans more than you know.. food, clothing, education, motivation... Hip Hop Govern's more effectively than most elected officials in these urban centers. You should go deeper talk to the local promoters, the bloggers, you will become enlighteded.. so much to understand, it's like life. It's hard, you know that, and once you have a complete understanding .... it's easy.. in Hip hop all are welcome. #Detroit4life.
Oh and many think that Drake is bad for Hip Hop, but he was welcomed in and has thrived. When you think that a Hip Hop band is the house band for the tonight show, you realize that it has reached were no one could picture ever. Not Russell, not sean Combs, not Sean Carter.. no one. So the sky's not a limit in Hip Hop it's only a view. Master P paved the way to the real money few know that.
James L. Jackson
___________________________________
Rap tells a STORY...Our brains latch on to all things mythologized, much more than facts and figures..Metaphors and parable drive home universal motifs .Thank you, Dr. Jung...Country songs USED TO tell stories, before every song bragged about how GREAT small town life is...Singer/songwriters USED TO, too, but where's the new generation of "folkies"? The Dylans, Springsteens, Paul Simons, Joni Mitchells, etc.? Pro writers, like Desmond Child (Living On A Prayer, etc.), have been replaced by Max Martins and corporate schills..Rap brings back the narrative to the song, much like the " beat" poets, commenting on their life and culture..In the post-instrument world, that may give them an edge ..
James Spencer
___________________________________
I think there is a more simple reason...
I am 37 years old now. My last 6 or so years have been in senior (ish) roles at various advertising companies. There are many in my demographic all earning similar money.
De La Soul was the first cassette I owned, back when I was 10 years old. Closely followed by Public Enemy, Ice T, Paris...
We grew up on hip hop, the rebellious sound our parents hated. It was my generation's rock and roll.
The sound has mellowed now, comparatively. But it is still the sound we grew up with.
When the people in suits, the people with kids starting high school, the directors, the advertising executives all grew up with the same sound, that is when it becomes mainstream.
My friend's 11 year old daughter can tell the difference between Phyfe and Q-Tip. We are now pulling our children into our culture, the same way my parents got me into Led Zep, The Doors, and The Stones.
Hip hop is the modern rock and roll, for many reasons.
Anthony Gardiner
New Zealand
___________________________________
Also the music buying public is still young people, as it always has been (old people are rarely open to new shit), and these 15-40s grew up where hip hop was the real rock n roll: the only place where anybody said or did anything shocking, the only real voice of the youth, the only real voice of the poor, etc. Hip hop also sells the same idea that America does: that Jay Z could rise from the projects in Bedford-Stuyvesant to being a multimillionaire; that you don't even have to be born in America to achieve superstardom in America (Drake). Until the mainstream media tv cameras are in the hood of Baltimore or St Louis for any other reason that a anti-police riot, hip hop will always be the dominant voice of the culture (poor people both black and white). When hip hop celebrates opulence or 'hoes' or whatever, it's selling a kid in the slums the idea that he could have that, too, so he's singing and streaming every word. Hence why I've been able to make a modest career out of speaking for suburban working class kids because I'm speaking their language, not speaking down to them, and telling them they can do it, too.
Spose/Ryan
___________________________________
I think Hip Hop is a genre that cultivates a feeling of vicarious living just as 80s glam rock did. It's one of the things music allows us to experience, which is a powerful experience of transcending the self in a way that gets us outside of ourselves and into a sort of character we want to play, or a life (real or not) we'd like to live (albeit an often romanticized one).
I think a more important realm of what music can help us to experience is the transcending our perceived limits of the self, and into our own potential, to push us deep into ourselves and get in touch with who we are and what has meaning.
Hip Hop can do that too of course... but, as a genre in pop, it's more known for how it provides an audio-costume we can wear.
Hip Hop is also a nice big caldron of stew (in terms of it's aesthetic of beats and other signature sounds like the 808 etc.) that other styles can be tossed into as spices. Pop has adopted hip hop just as it did rock (think of all the pop-rock girls of the earlier 90s who's producers commandeered rock aesthetics).
Adam Watts
___________________________________
Bob - this is one of the most direct, best articles I've read on this area.
The differences, as you've pointed out, are basically just embarrassing for us whites.
For example no offence to Lady Gaga, but in some ways I thought that she represented the epitome of a lost white performer - constantly looking for a new image, not standing for any one thing. I know she was attempting to be a fashion icon, but you can't do that at the expense of your message. (To her credit her new material, which is right off the beaten track for her, does prove how much of a musical talent she really is).
I can see some parallels between hip hop music and the Irish culture - externally they're both love, light and peace brother, but internally it's all about the anger.
To my mind, there is no point in white guys trying to do rap.
Don't get me wrong, I've watched some of the competitions and I know that there are some highly accomplished white guys, but they can never truly 'do black' like a black person (full respect to them for wanting to though).
Hip hop & rap - it's 100% theirs.
As you say they're 100% consistent in term of message (which I imagine isn't even something that they have to analyse much, they're just doing their thing, it's what they are).
As you're saying, we've still got a lot to learn!
I wonder though if we just did our thing, and stopped trying to over analyse, where would we be?
Evan Linwood
___________________________________
Why is McDonald's big?
Not what you think. Simple is best.
Most taste is simple. And affordable
Philip/Philertoo
___________________________________
Because it's "real"
Signed.
- Mike
Mike Mathewson
Vice President, Marketing
Columbia Records – Sony Music Entertainment
___________________________________
Round of applause!!!
Rahim TheDream
___________________________________
I'm one of them white elites. Well...I'm white. And I play the AAA format.
While the idea of me rapping is terrible that doesn't mean there aren't good lessons to be learned here.
Thanks for keeping it real.
Bobbo
___________________________________
Great post! I never looked at it like that. Cheers!
-Mike Boden
Engineer/editor
___________________________________
Because it has a beat and you can dance to it.
David Tobin
___________________________________
I only needed to read your first questIon to be able to answer.
BECAUSE ITS GREAT FUCKING MUSIC AND LYRICS AND TESTAMENT TO THE REAL FUCKING HUMAN CONDITION!!!!!!
xo
John Brower
___________________________________
Spoken like a true old white guy.
You really missed it on this one, Bob.
1. Hip Hop is popular because it is fantasy. It delivers the listener into a world where the helpless and hopeless have power and money... And women. The songs make young people feel powerful. And it is that feeling of power that is addictive about Hip Hop.
2. Don't believe the hype. There is nothing authentic about Hip Hop. It is lowbrow music from the uneducated, the poverty stricken, and those living within another fantasy of power... Gangsterism. Thugs feel power in their own little world, and Hip Hop and Gangster Rap are nothing more than an extension of the illusion of the machismo of a thug's life.
3. White youth since the days of Yo! MTV Raps have been sold by the entertainment industry the lie that everything black is cooler and better. MTV promoted the concept of the trophy black boyfriend and immediately white teenage girls were pairing up with black thugs from the hood.
4. White youth are as receptive to the illusions of power as young blacks, maybe more so. Because for them it is safe to fantasize about being feared, murdering and having money, driving Ferraris, and banging out four babes at a time. No different that the fantasies young people experience vicariously in watching the most popular action movies, or playing video games.
5. Hip Hop has been a curse on our culture. The music is destructive. It promotes violence and misogyny, death and personal destruction... The music is a lie. There is no power, it's all a fantasy.
6. Are there some great Hip Hop songs? Of course, but the music is empty calories.
7. Why is Hip Hop so popular? Blame it on the corruption of the music and radio industries. Blame it on the liberals in entertainment who use music, movies, and TV as propaganda devices to impart their ideological agendas; part of which is to blame all that is wrong with America on the white establishment and its cultural traditions. This while assiduously promoting as cool the culture of violence, death, and misogyny which inflicts the worst of our society.
8. Hip Hop is no different than drugs. It makes you feel great and powerful while it destroys your life. Just ask all the families of dead rappers. Just ask all the families of the tens of thousands of dead thugs who bought into the fantasy. And just ask the innocent victims of the criminals who choose a gangster lifestyle because it sounded great in a song.
Frank A. Gagliano
___________________________________
Dude. Trump is not hip-hop. Hip-hop is doing well because it has something to say about the big picture...dreams, mostly unrealized, commoditized, advertised & dangled...guaranteed in degrees to some, forbidden to others. It's a sane & lucid commentary on an insane & opaque system.
Trump is white convention & privilege personified, an out of the closet, in your face racist & wannabe overseer. He may validate what hip-hop has been saying about what white cultural supremacy has hidden under it's orderly smile, but he is NOT hip-hop.
Hip-hop is so out front that it's examining itself for improvements. Trump is not capable of that & he never will be.
Don't take it from me, check J. Cole:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvFDXV0VBg4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5slZHLSnow
best, bbb
wheatus.com
___________________________________
Spot on.
Sam Cavanagh
___________________________________
Kendrick Lamar, for the win.
John Kay
___________________________________
Further evidence of our predilection for story..EVER see ANY contestant on ANY singing competition show, without a riveting back-story? I didn't think so..They don't make the cut, talented as they may be..Joe six pack tunes in, to see the stories, feel the shared humanity..Half-minute snippets of ALREADY familiar cover tunes, are gratuitous..Celebrity banter from the judges is entertaining as well, and, totally scripted...The music is filler, at best..
James Spencer
___________________________________
Part of it is that there is still interesting and innovative hip hop being released on a regular basis. Rock, on the other hand... I dare you to listen to pretty much anything from the Rock section of the New music tab on Apple Music -- dreadful. It all sounds the same and it's all pretty much fucking terrible. Perhaps there is the odd exception, but the tepid swamp that it would have to inhabit makes finding it pretty much the least enticing exercise I could think of. More like torturous, actually.
The other thing is that hip hop has been this huge since, at least, as early as the 90s -- when I was in elementary school. The thing is, 90%+ of my generation were downloading nearly their entire collections of music since napster came out (I remember being one of the very few who would drop a bunch of dough at the cd store on a regular basis). Now that streaming puts hard statistics on it, maybe it seems like the hegemonic popularity of hip hop is big news, but a lot of it is really just that there is a new dominant mode of distribution which records stats properly.
As an afterthought, I guess it's also a reflection of the fact that my generation is increasingly making up a larger portion of the population as time goes on.
Regardless, it's too bad about rock n roll music. I grew up on it and immersed myself in it from a young age, but the art form died a long time ago.
Best,
James Cameron
___________________________________
Not bad, although the final paragraph should be first. "And then there's the truth." The power is in the resonation of putting yourself out there for your art. People can feel truth. Truth knows no genre.
However- you forgot to speak about the art form. I cherish 2 guitars a bass and drums (sprinkle in some keys too), but just because hip hop doesn't have that old "white norm" doesn't make it any less artful, creative, and unique.
Have you ever tried to freestyle? Give it a whirl Bob! When you don't speak of the lifelong commitment to becoming a lyricist the same way you speak of the great guitarists you are missing out on some of the rarest artistic talents there are.
Nick Lawson
___________________________________
Fuck, yeah, Bob.
This is the history of music/art in one missive.
BeBop, Rock & Roll, Punk, Hip hop, EDM. All giving the middle finger to the "normal" world. THIS is what causes change.
Thanks for the reminder. Thanks from a white guy in Burbank.
David Benson
___________________________________
25 mutherfucking years of total talentless crap!!
theshopdj
___________________________________
Hi Bob, from New Zealand
Hip-hop is simply the new rock n roll, now that the old rock n roll has sold out to the machine. Hip-hop grates and rebels across cultures, and thus unites them. If it irritates, it is doing the same job the original rock n rollers did, so rejoice, I reckon :)
Derrin Richards (48)
___________________________________
Great one,
Marshall Crenshaw
___________________________________
SO TRUE.
You should e started with this: "And then there's the truth. The rappers are saying what's on their mind....." AND "no other musical format has a chance unless it embraces some of the hip-hop ethos."
EXCELLENTE, MAESTRO!
Wally Wilson
___________________________________
Bob, watch Hip Hop Foundations on Netflix. Might help answer some questions.
George Drakoulias
___________________________________
I only read a few paragraphs but you sound salty and racist.
Are only the genres you enjoy the only genres that deserve to have "true demand?"
I get you're trying to be ridiculous but to say "trump is hip hop" is a complete misunderstanding of what hip hop is.
Do some research, write another post, then I'll finish reading. Save us all some time and try to not fit the stereotype of old salty as racist ass old ass man.
Thx
James Calkins
P.S. You don't understand hip hop. Please don't pretend to be an expert in all things.
P.P.S. Finished it. Still don't think you know what you're talking about. The statement I agreed with most though is when you say "there's power in hip hop." I agree with that.
___________________________________
You're writing an article in 2016 on "why is hip hop so big"? Hip Hop became a white suburban phenomenon in the 90s when gangsta rap was born. The suburban big box stores like Walmart and Best Buy were selling cases of it and quickly learned it had grown from the streets to bedroom communities. It took rap albums from gold to multi platinum like Tupac and Biggie. White kids heard it as rebellious as the early days of classic rock.
But Bob Leftsetz was still pondering The Beatles and Dylan phenomenon before from previous generations. Really sad and limited your views are.
Kirk Bonin
___________________________________
These two statements are highly offensive to me as a Black man.
"But African-Americans have been screwed from time immemorial"
"They know you've got to fight for your piece of the pie, the big piece of chicken"
Knock it off Bob, the same thing you're criticizing in this piece is the same thing you're doing. I'm someone who came up in hip hop culture and worked in it on the label side, but leave out the BS man.
chuck welch
(Note: "big piece of chicken" is a reference to the Chris Rock HBO special: http://bit.ly/1lx936U)
___________________________________
Superb ...
Jerry Dickens
___________________________________
…and all the whining twats who bitch about Tupac getting into the RRHOF, because he's not "rock'n'roll". Idiots.
-Hugo Burnham
___________________________________
Yep, Harvard offers a hip-hop program already: http://hutchinscenter.fas.harvard.edu/announcing-nasir-jones-hiphop-fellowship
I'm sure there are plenty others as well…
Jonathan Christiansen
___________________________________
Morning Bob!
Yes, there is a course on hip-hop, at Wellesley - see below. Merry Christmas!
http://www.wellesley.edu/academics/faculty/spotlight/spotlighthiphop
Live richly,
Aaron Koral
___________________________________
Thanks for an interesting article.
Errol Howery
___________________________________
Beautifully written.
And your right, they do teach it in college and have for quite some time. I was the TA in 'History of Hip Hop' at UCSD in 2003..
Josh Berman
___________________________________
The pillars of hip hop (MC... DJ...BBoy...graffiti...knowledge) are the foundation of any good digital strategy for an artist. Hip hop was born and bred for the internet and is the blueprint for any artist today. Rock is the opposite...does not work on the internet. Same with dance music, doesn't work online, which is part of the reason EDM happened. Country I can't really say. Pop takes notes from hip hop and doesn't exist without it.
Sean Glass
___________________________________
Hip hop is a movement and lifestyle as all mainstream musical genres harness. Essential viewing if you haven't seen yet:
https://www.netflix.com/title/80141782
The LA episode is amazing to see the size and energy of the early parties with NWA and WW Wrecking Crew. 10,000+ people rocking out. It reminds me both of Chuck Brown's Gogos and warehouse raves of the 90's.
Also recommend Jeff Chang's hip hop history book "Can't Stop Won't Stop". His latest essay in Fader is also worth the read:
http://www.thefader.com/2016/12/19/after-donald-trump-essay/amp
Happy holidays,
Greg Lucas
___________________________________
You are 100% correct.
Raymond Traylor
___________________________________
Hello Bob! Longtime reader, enjoy your commentary! Hip hop is interesting. It's all about telling your story and as a genre it can vary greatly sound wise in order to tell that story. It is fascinating though on how quickly it has grown. Born out of disco and built on struggle. For a lot of artists it's make the music happen or go back to the trap. Each artist is just trying to rep their neighborhood and get their story heard. They have no other option. Perhaps it's because rock has failed to stay current with the trends and has become too PC, no rock artist is trashing hotels or getting arrested anymore, wtf, what happened to the swagger in rock? Perhaps it's the fact that hiphop is also about combining different ideas, which inherently will draw a wider range of listeners. It's not only hiphop but it's dance, it's rock, it jazz, it's funk, whatever sounds combine to create the artists story. It's rather fascinating how music has transformed and evolved over the years. Hiphop is just our voice. Art in simplicity with moments of complexity. It will be interesting to see it evolve.
-Sam Krutz
___________________________________
I always wondered what sort of music I could possibly hate when I got older. I call it 2 tone cheerleader adult self indulgent nursery rhymes.
Ah yeah ah yeah ? Know what I'm sayyying?
We've been hearing the same phrases....
Hardly musical.
Christopher Dwight Harris
___________________________________
Why Hip Hop?
Why Electronica?
Why Trance Music?
MDMA.
Like the learning modules in The Matrix.
Joan Carlson
___________________________________
Hip Hop is big because anyone can ghetto limerick even all those urban white wanna be gangstas. They all believe they can make it and become big rap stars wearing the golden bling, live the pimp lifestyle and all the girls want to sleep with them.
Hip hoppers are flavors of the week and they all figure they're going to get rich & famous or die trying....
M 1
___________________________________
You know why? Because they are the new rock stars. While ASAP Rocky is having acid induced orgies at SXSW (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/05/26/asap-rocky-sxsw-lsd-orgies_n_7443122.html), the so called "rock" artists are busy drinking Pressed Juicers and trying to get some 25 year old A&R to put them on the list to see Duran Duran.
ARI INGEL
___________________________________
You speak the truth. Amen to that.
Happy holidays,
Greg Haledjian
___________________________________
"And then there's the truth. The rappers are saying what's on their mind, in a world where so few do, where all messages are filtered and homogenized. Do you get the appeal?
Not that I'm an expert, far from it, but I can see that hip-hop is the anti, and no other musical format has a chance unless it embraces some of the hip-hop ethos." BL
Clarity. And this "anti" and non filtered, non homogenized ethos is precisely what is missing from pop music because no one wants to take a chance and express themselves when they're trying to rake in "the man's" back yard.
Generic. Formula music from predictable acts, thrown together like a $7 plate of pasta.
I am genuflecting toward your location.
Bill Shafer
___________________________________
Mr Lefsetz, I have a NEW found respect for you! In the past I often felt you kind of beat up on the culture. But your analysis of it was spot on! And you are correct it is taught in all institutions of learning from kindergarten to college. I run a 4 elements hip hop program Called Def Ed. Where we use the culture as a creative means for the youth to express themselves. Fostering such values as tolerance, non-violence, creative self expression among others. We use rap in particular to increase literacy amOngst inner city youth. And we have the quantifiable impact to back it up! This is not a music! Hip Hop is a 4 elements culture. Emceeing (rapping) breaking, Djing, and Aerosol art (graffiti) we have tirelessly worked to decriminalize the public's image of the culture. Many hip hop beat producers teach on college campuses like little brothers Ninth Wonder and the Roots quest love to name a few. I teach a musicology piece at San Francisco State. Where we start with the Griots the people who led the bragging circles in ancient Africa. To the negroe spirituals during slavery all the way to modern contemporary rap. It's unapologetic stance on things along with its inclusion of all ( unless we feel cultural appropriation is it play) is why it will always resonate with people! People have to understand we started the (out of the trunk) indie game. From Too $hort to Master P to hammer. These guys were already millionaires b4 the suits knew of them. A lot of us took our street hustle mentality into the music game and won. Why? Because unlike those who could afford Julliard and be given a shot by the gate keepers. We said "open the door I'll get it myself!
James Evans
___________________________________
Hip Hop and all the machine music that is being generated is the reason Music Row in Nashville is being bulldozed down and Condos are on the rise. Not to mention all the people deciding to just
Get out of the music industry and start a taco stand in heaven.
It was FUN for a while. Now...let's go back to where we started...writing and recording Jingles.
Christopher Dwight Harris
___________________________________
It's a great question.. one that I've pondered endlessly . Why? I have two teenage sons. One that treats hip hop as a religion. His faves: Tyler the creator , Kanye , childish Gambino, frank ocean. If he spent as much time on homework as he does on a website called rap genius, he might actually make it through 11th grade. Also, it might start with the music , but it's also about life style. Supreme rules. $200 hoodies. And when I looked at him and said , I can really appreciate Eminem as a poet, his reply: "you are so white" . I wanted to tell him he was too, but I figured deep down he knows it!
So what is the attraction ? I listen... so what am I missing? As the resident Dylan freak of Merrick Long Island, my parents surely felt the same way... but still!
Now here's where it gets confusing . My other teenage son despises all things hip hop. His go to Spotify playlist is made up of Beatles , Stones, and all things 60s and 70s. Is that like someone in my high school class of 77 being a Sinatra freak? Of
Course my hip hop son teases his brother endlessly for his musical tastes calling him an 80 year old man in a 15 year old body. Which brings me back to your original question "why is hip hop so big"? And your answer: "I don't know". Damned if I do either.
Brian Lukow
___________________________________
Bob
Kanye plays the inauguration.
You better believe it.
Jon OKeefe
--
Visit the archive: http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/
--
http://www.twitter.com/lefsetz
--
If you would like to subscribe to the LefsetzLetter,
http://www.lefsetz.com/lists/?p=subscribe&id=1
If you do not want to receive any more LefsetzLetters, http://lefsetz.com/lists/?p=unsubscribe&uid=0eecea7b60b461717065cbde887c8e25
To change your email address http://lefsetz.com/lists/?p=preferences&uid=0eecea7b60b461717065cbde887c8e25
-- powered by phpList, www.phplist.com --
No comments:
Post a Comment
Note: only a member of this blog may post a comment.